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scaleface

will hooks lose their temper

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 I  poured a  few spinnerbaits today and once again had a hard time getting a complete product . I just tapped the lead off the hook/wire and re-poured them . I poured one  five times before getting a complete  lure . Does this hurt the hooks ? 

 

 I dip the incomplete lure back into the molten lead to melt it  then  try it again .

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Not unless you make them really mad. 🤣 Sorry, I don't know much about lure making. (and sorry for the terrible jokes)

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Not by any means an expert but i doubt it since the hooks dont really get hot

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13 minutes ago, EGbassing said:

Not unless you make them really mad. 🤣 Sorry, I don't know much about lure making. (and sorry for the terrible jokes)

Haha , you made me check and see if I spelled it wrong .

Just now, Bdnoble84 said:

Not by any means an expert but i doubt it since the hooks dont really get hot

They get real hot . I dip them in the molten lead to melt the hardened lead . I forgot to mention that .

 

 

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Lead melts at like 650 degrees, steel is like 2900 degrees so the lead will never get hot enough to change the temper of the hooks. If you are holding them under a torch for an extended time you can change the temper otherwise you should be good.

 

Allen

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I've done some forging along the way, which required some hardening and tempering.

While I don't know the exact steel used for hooks, I do know that tool steel tempers start in the 350 degree range.

The good news is that the hooks are really thin compared to bar steel, so heat shouldn't transfer very far. 

What you are likely left with is a softer (less brittle, easier to bend) part of the hook shank. May be that on a normal pour the lead cools enough in the mold that not much heat makes it into the hook. But putting the lead back in the hot lead... if it's tool steel it is reducing hardness.

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Like Munkin mentioned, there will be no adverse effect. The few second you hold a hook in the lead is nothing as far as heat range goes. The only thing you might see is the plating especailly tin plated hooks slightly change color. You're good to go even if you re-pour the hook a dozen times.

 

Which model spinnerbait are you pouring? Maybe we can help you solve your problem.

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7 minutes ago, cadman said:

Which model spinnerbait are you pouring? Maybe we can help you solve your problem.

Do-It molds Bullet  spinner . I even applied some  of that spray on stuff . The collar doesnt   fill . I  use a Hot Pot and pour lead in the empty blanks to warm the mold . It all looks good until i add the wire hook harness .

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36 minutes ago, scaleface said:

Do-It molds Bullet  spinner . I even applied some  of that spray on stuff . The collar doesnt   fill . I  use a Hot Pot and pour lead in the empty blanks to warm the mold . It all looks good until i add the wire hook harness .

What looks like is happening is you are trapping air at the collar. This is what I would try first.

 

#1 make sure your mold is hot and not warm. Put your mold on the Hot Pot to heat it.

#2 put your hooks and wireforms under a  light. I use a reflector shield with a 100 watt bulb. By heating the wire  and the hook, you will not have any real cold spots for the lead to stick as you pour.

#3 stick a piece of tape or two to gap the mold. By gapping the mold, you will separate the mold halves letting air escape. Start your gapping at the mold handles. This will give you the least amount of gap and less flash. The closer you put the tape to the hinge area the more gap you will have. The more gap you have the bigger chance of flash you will get. The correct balance to this is to get full pours with the minimum amount of lead flash on the finished head.

#4 you may be also pouring the lead in too fast into the mold. Try getting a 1 oz ladle. I believe they are around $8. This way you can pour with the ladle from your pot

 

That is it. This should work for you. If you would like to discuss further, you can call me via phone if you would like.

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16 minutes ago, cadman said:

#1 make sure your mold is hot and not warm. Put your mold on the Hot Pot to heat it.

About how long  does it take to sufficiently heat the mold ?

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Just now, scaleface said:

About how long  does it take to sufficiently heat the mold ?

You want the mold hot, so you can't grab it and hold it. On a Hot pot maybe 15 minutes. Depends if where you are it is cold inside or warm.

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txchaser is right, depending on the steel the transformation that will cause steel to change some of its properties can happen below the melting point of lead.  I think the best approach is to test your worst case jig hook against a new one by simply pulling on a strong line with the jig attached at its eye and the hook point being pulled into soft wood.  This will apply a bending force to the hook, and if the change in strength is significant you should be able to find it.

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I should have been clearer that different steels will have different heat treatments and therefore could react differently to the hot lead.  If you use many different hooks you should test a sample of them all.  I expect most will be unaffected, but the only way to tell is to test.

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will hooks lose their temper?

 

Not if they are Valyrian steel.

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24 minutes ago, BassWhole! said:

will hooks lose their temper?

 

Not if they are Valyrian steel.

That stuff is had to find .

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Just now, scaleface said:

That stuff is had to find .

I get it from Missandei....

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You will not anneal temper steel jig hooks by putting the hook eye end back into the molten lead. 

Your problem is the mold isn't venting properly and is too cold. Just place the jig mold on top of the lead pot to warm it. You also need to degass the lead by using about a teaspoon of candle wax into the molten lead. While the wax is burning put your open mold on top of the smoking pot, smoke is a good release coating.

Gapping the mold will cause flash if it's more then .010, give it a try before filing a permanent vent.

Tom

PS, Gamakatsu, Owner and Mustad are all high temp steels unaffected by  molten lead temps.

Tom

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2 hours ago, BassWhole! said:

will hooks lose their temper?

 

Not if they are Valyrian steel.

Waiting on some Vibranium hooks from Wakanda myself.

 

Allen

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