Does anyone else who uses the snell knot have breaking issues on certain hooks? The reason I ask is I like to snell octopus style hooks like the Gamakatsu Octopus hooks. The issue I seem to have is when the eye is made the end of the hook wire is simply folded over, which leaves a corner of metal that the snell knot seems to be getting pinched in, and I'm getting pretty terrible breaking strengths using it on hooks that have eyes like these. I know VMC makes some worm hooks with epoxy protected eyelets but their octopus hooks do not have this feature. Do any other brands make octopus hooks with welded or epoxied eyes?

The only hook I snell is a Trokar TK 130 which I use for flipping in heavy cover or for punching. The hook eye is also as you describe but I don't have that problem. 

Maybe the design of the Octopus hook lends itself to the problem you're having or it could be a Gammy production run problem. 

 

Mike

I've only had troubles snelling Daiichi hooks,
but that's about it that I can think of. 

The bend you mention too often has a "sharp"
edge to it.

4 hours ago, Darren. said:

I've only had troubles snelling Daiichi hooks,
but that's about it that I can think of. 

The bend you mention too often has a "sharp"
edge to it.

Yea that's what I'm thinking is causing it because when it breaks it's right around that area. Does anyone know of a brand that makes Octopus hooks with sealed eyes? 

49 minutes ago, MassYak85 said:

Yea that's what I'm thinking is causing it because when it breaks it's right around that area. Does anyone know of a brand that makes Octopus hooks with sealed eyes? 

You should take a look at the "big nasty" octopus hooks by Trokar (model TK11). They have a welded eye that takes away those sharp edges. Might work for you, as long as you don't need a small hook. I think 4/0 is the smallest size I've seen for these.

I snell circle hooks almost exclusively for all my saltwater fishing, but I've never had that issue. How is the line running into a sharp spot on the eye? Maybe has something to do with the weight? Have you tried using a bead spacer between the weight and the hook? Or are you getting the break offs even during your tests?

6 hours ago, BrackishBassin said:

I snell circle hooks almost exclusively for all my saltwater fishing, but I've never had that issue. How is the line running into a sharp spot on the eye? Maybe has something to do with the weight? Have you tried using a bead spacer between the weight and the hook? Or are you getting the break offs even during your tests?

Well I'm using these octopus hooks for ice fishing actually, so no weight, they're going to be just hanging there with a shiner on them. They are breaking while testing them. But It seems to me that one of the coils of the snell knot is getting caught in the space created by the unfinished hook eye, and the pinch point is causing it to break sooner than it should.

11 hours ago, BradGinKC said:

You should take a look at the "big nasty" octopus hooks by Trokar (model TK11). They have a welded eye that takes away those sharp edges. Might work for you, as long as you don't need a small hook. I think 4/0 is the smallest size I've seen for these.

Those are a little big for what I'm doing. I actually am not a huge fan of trokar hooks. I've had a lot of their hook point roll on me.

2 minutes ago, MassYak85 said:

Those are a little big for what I'm doing. I actually am not a huge fan of trokar hooks. I've had a lot of their hook point roll on me.

Did your hook points roll on their octopus hooks? Or has it happened on other types of trokar hooks too? I've never used the trokar octopus hooks, but I use the trokar finesse worm & flippin hooks a lot. This was only my first season using trokar hooks, but I fished them hard this year, especially the flippin hooks, and never had an issue. Then again, I didn't set any records for size either! Trokar hooks aren't cheap, so I'm curious how big of an issue this is before I stock up on them for next season. 

55 minutes ago, BradGinKC said:

Did your hook points roll on their octopus hooks? Or has it happened on other types of trokar hooks too? I've never used the trokar octopus hooks, but I use the trokar finesse worm & flippin hooks a lot. This was only my first season using trokar hooks, but I fished them hard this year, especially the flippin hooks, and never had an issue. Then again, I didn't set any records for size either! Trokar hooks aren't cheap, so I'm curious how big of an issue this is before I stock up on them for next season. 

I normally don't buy their hooks because of the cost. The issues I had with hook points rolling were on spinnerbaits and jigs that used them. I think I had two spinnerbaits and one jig (IIRC) have their hook points roll. I've never tried their worm hooks or any other types. I'm not saying don't use them, especially if you've used their worm and flippin hooks with no issues, I just don't have a lot of confidence in them in my experiences. 

1 hour ago, MassYak85 said:

Well I'm using these octopus hooks for ice fishing actually, so no weight, they're going to be just hanging there with a shiner on them. They are breaking while testing them. But It seems to me that one of the coils of the snell knot is getting caught in the space created by the unfinished hook eye, and the pinch point is causing it to break sooner than it should.

Those are a little big for what I'm doing. I actually am not a huge fan of trokar hooks. I've had a lot of their hook point roll on me.

That's weird. Let me check what I'm using and get back with you. I've also got some Gamakatsu octopus hooks I use for my dropshots and wacky rigs. I'll snell one up and see what it does.

Alright, here's what I've got. I use Eagle Claw size 1 circle hooks for my saltwater stuff. No issues with snell knots breaking with them.

I also snelled up one of the size 1 octopus hooks I have from Gamakatsu and yanked on it pretty good. I was able to break it with the 6lb test mono, but I was yanking on it with a pair of pliers. Re-snelled it with 15lb test mono and was able to get it to break, but it definitely took some doing. Nothing a fish would be capable of, unless we're talking something huge. Both times it broke at/near the knot, but didn't appear to be from the eye. I think the line just plain gave way, which will always be at the knot since that's the weakest part of the line.

This may sound weird, but what type of snell knot are you using? I've seen videos where guys use a loop when snelling their hooks, but I don't. Just the single piece of line laying against the shank of the hook, and I haven't had any issues. Is that a possibility?

46 minutes ago, BrackishBassin said:

Alright, here's what I've got. I use Eagle Claw size 1 circle hooks for my saltwater stuff. No issues with snell knots breaking with them.

I also snelled up one of the size 1 octopus hooks I have from Gamakatsu and yanked on it pretty good. I was able to break it with the 6lb test mono, but I was yanking on it with a pair of pliers. Re-snelled it with 15lb test mono and was able to get it to break, but it definitely took some doing. Nothing a fish would be capable of, unless we're talking something huge. Both times it broke at/near the knot, but didn't appear to be from the eye. I think the line just plain gave way, which will always be at the knot since that's the weakest part of the line.

This may sound weird, but what type of snell knot are you using? I've seen videos where guys use a loop when snelling their hooks, but I don't. Just the single piece of line laying against the shank of the hook, and I haven't had any issues. Is that a possibility?

I use this version (with the loop you are talking about I believe)

I might try it the other way and see if it is any different.

 

Edit*: So after trying both methods both are breaking by hand without a terrible amount of effort, enough to break on a hookset. I tied a palomar to compare and I couldn't break it by hand. 

1 hour ago, MassYak85 said:

I use this version (with the loop you are talking about I believe)

I might try it the other way and see if it is any different.

 

Edit*: So after trying both methods both are breaking by hand without a terrible amount of effort, enough to break on a hookset. I tied a palomar to compare and I couldn't break it by hand. 

Man, that's weird. Almost makes me wonder if you got a bad lot of hooks or something. 

17 minutes ago, BrackishBassin said:

Man, that's weird. Almost makes me wonder if you got a bad lot of hooks or something. 

I'm wondering if line diameter has something to do with it. I've used heavier fluoro leaders before and never had issues. But you might be right with the hooks because I've used 12lb line before with Gamy circle hooks and they didn't even break this easy. 

 I almost exclusively snell gammy octopus hooks. Anywhere from a #10 on 6lb fluoro for trout to an 8/0 on 80lb fluoro for amberjack, never had this problem you have mentioned.

2 hours ago, MassYak85 said:

I'm wondering if line diameter has something to do with it. I've used heavier fluoro leaders before and never had issues. But you might be right with the hooks because I've used 12lb line before with Gamy circle hooks and they didn't even break this easy. 

That might be a contributing factor, for sure. 

Alright update guys. After rigging all my leaders for ice fishing I think I can safely say that the issue was either the line I was using. I rigged up all my leaders with fluoro leader material and Gammy Octopus hooks and had no issues. So I suspect it was probably the line I was using to practice the first time around that was causing the issues. It was some field and stream mono and I think it was kinking easily and that was causing the breaking issue.