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Bassnajr

Hard times hitting B.A.S.S Elite series tournaments.....

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What about this years Elite series schedule???

Down from 11 to 8 tournaments with 2 "Post Season" AOY events. Anglers, according to Gerald Swindle (BASS Magazine 2/2009) "will be paying the same entry fees for less events and less chances to win."

Some anglers sponsorships are down %40 from last year.

I bet will see more of the Elite anglers on the F.L.W. Tour, but how will F.L.W. be affected???

Comment???

ajr

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The area around here is flooded with circuits. I wish they would combine a few and let some of the others just go away. Any weekend you can pick from around 20+ tournaments to fish on the lakes, granted a lot are under 50 boats it is still way too many. You can also fish a tournament on Mondays, Tuesdays, Wednesdays, Thursdays, and I'm not sure about Friday but there probably is one. Too many.

Yes, I fish tournaments to.  

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I think B.A.S.S is definitely falling more to the wayside with the FLW offering much higher payouts down the standings, more help with sponsership, and reaching out to a broader fan base...The one advantage BASS has is that its owned by ESPN, but that is also a disadvantage because they have to compete for airtime with major mainstream sports...I keep close track of both B.A.S.S and FLW events, and alot of the big BASS names have definitely been testing the FLW waters ...I think that if some of the top names in BASS switch over to FLW, the FLW boys will be in for a surprise, because IMO the fishing skill is definitelty higher on the BASS circuit than on the FLW, with a few exceptions of course.

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I think B.A.S.S is definitely falling more to the wayside with the FLW offering much higher payouts down the standings, more help with sponsership, and reaching out to a broader fan base...The one advantage BASS has is that its owned by ESPN, but that is also a disadvantage because they have to compete for airtime with major mainstream sports...I keep close track of both B.A.S.S and FLW events, and alot of the big BASS names have definitely been testing the FLW waters ...I think that if some of the top names in BASS switch over to FLW, the FLW boys will be in for a surprise, because IMO the fishing skill is definitelty higher on the BASS circuit than on the FLW, with a few exceptions of course.

    To comment on the payouts,   At one time, BASS elites had 11 events and 3 majors compared to the 6 events total for the FLW.

  Do the math.    6 events to 11 events, almost twice as many tournaments, so even though the payouts where less, they provided more opportunities on the BASS circuits.     Add the extra 5 regular season events and you'll see payouts aren't as you suggest.

   

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I do agree with Tuckman that at one time FLW was considered by many as the "AAA" (Minor leauge) ball club of the B.A.S.S. Elite Series. I feel that this will change soon.

I am not a statistics guy, but from watching both groups, it does appear that the weights are much higher for B.A.S.S. than F.L.W.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

ajr

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I think B.A.S.S is definitely falling more to the wayside with the FLW offering much higher payouts down the standings, more help with sponsership, and reaching out to a broader fan base...The one advantage BASS has is that its owned by ESPN, but that is also a disadvantage because they have to compete for airtime with major mainstream sports...I keep close track of both B.A.S.S and FLW events, and alot of the big BASS names have definitely been testing the FLW waters ...I think that if some of the top names in BASS switch over to FLW, the FLW boys will be in for a surprise, because IMO the fishing skill is definitelty higher on the BASS circuit than on the FLW, with a few exceptions of course.

To comment on the payouts, At one time, BASS elites had 11 events and 3 majors compared to the 6 events total for the FLW.

Do the math. 6 events to 11 events, almost twice as many tournaments, so even though the payouts where less, they provided more opportunities on the BASS circuits. Add the extra 5 regular season events and you'll see payouts aren't as you suggest.

"At one time" Vanilla Ice was popular too...

I was more talking about the direction that things seem to be going "right now"...Also dont forget that FLW outdoors sanctions the Stren Series, and the BFL, offering just as much entry level opportunity as BASS...I am a big fan of both organizations and am not trying to knock either one, but the fast growth of the FLW is undisputable :)

P.S- I am not, and would never think of comparing BASS to Vanilla Ice in any shape way or form...even debate has its boundries ;)

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I have to think that because times are down, that BASS is trying to save money and just survive until the economy turns around.  The PWT is no longer around because of this.  I believe that when the economy turns around BASS will go back to 11 events, but until then it needs a way to continue its events without spending too much money to the point where they can no longer afford to run the circuit.

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I would have to disagree.  I used to follow both circuits equally but in the last few years I have not had a desire to follow FLW like I do with BASS. I don't know about the comment that BASS' pros have been "testing" the waters of the FLW.  I think it is exactly the opposite.  Matt Herren, Mark Davis, Todd Auten, and Greg Vinson all have made the switch from FLW to BASS with the exception of Greg Pugh.  I know Ike fished a Sten series even on Buggs Island but that was just for the money since he did not fish the rest of the events with hopes to qualify for the FLW tour.  

I agree that BASS went to a shorter schedule this year in order to cut expenses for both BASS and its customers (Elite pros) and will more than likely return to the same 11 tournament schedule once the economy rebounds.

FLW may offer these "team" deals for some of their pros but the deals are not that profitable for the pros (they are very lucrative on BASS side when they land a nonendemic) and can be taken from them and given to another competitor from year to year.  FLW also restricts who you promote if they do not align with 'their' sponsors.  IE Skeeter Boats, Duke University (sorry had to throw that one out there for Jeff Coble), etc.

These are just my opinions so sorry if I have offended anyone but I just feel more strongly towards to upper level at BASS.  But I do fish BFL's  ;D

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With the FLW guys going to BASS that were mentioned.  Don't forget the big guns that moved, and stayed with FLW:  Jay Yelas, Larry Nixon, George Cochran, Dion/Guido Hibdon, David Fritts.

A lot of BASS guys fish the FLW Series to try to get into the FLW Championship.  It's just another way for them to make a living.

I don't think one circuit is better and I don't think the fisherman are better from one circuit to another.  It's more about what's a better fit for them.  I think a lot of people think of FLW pros as AAA because they don't have the coverage that BASS does, so they don't know the anglers as well.

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It's all about making $$$$$

If the BASS anglers opportunities are cut, they will have to find a place to make up the money.....F.L.W.

Their sponsorships are being cut, travel is more expensive, hell, EVERYTHING is more expensive!!

You will see more BASS guys fishing F.L.W. if only for the $$$$$>

ajr

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I don't know about the comment that BASS' pros have been "testing" the waters of the FLW. I think it is exactly the opposite. Matt Herren, Mark Davis, Todd Auten, and Greg Vinson all have made the switch from FLW to BASS with the exception of Greg Pugh. I know Ike fished a Sten series even on Buggs Island but that was just for the money since he did not fish the rest of the events with hopes to qualify for the FLW tour.

Ike actually fished the entire 2008 stren northern division, and dominated, then finished 8th in the stren championship, and in the in the interveiw after he said he wanted to do it to qualify for the 2009 FLW championship in Pittsburg(which he has qualified for) because it might be closest thing he will ever have to a home championship.

Greg Hackney, Takahiro, Tommmy Biffle, and Mark Rose are a few more B.A.S.S guys who have qualified for the 2009 FLW Championship. David Fritts made the switch to FLW full time and has been put the hurt down on those boys all winter. I can only Imagine the devastation that KVD could lay down upon the FLW boys :o

That being said I saw bass covered this all in the new BASSMASTER issue, and they hope that the cuts will help them get through all this bad economy *****...I sure hope so too :)...as long as there are two pro circuits, I have twice the chance of making it on one of them 8-)

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As someone who's pretty close to a number of the BASS guys, here's what I can tell you

The payouts in the FLW may be larger, the guys say it's harder to make a living because of how FLW has always handled the sponsorship issue. FLW helps arrange sponsors to some degree, but only for the top 10 or 15 guys. This leaves a whole massive group of guys who either have to pay their way with winnings (easier said than done) or who have to convince sponsors on their own that the limited exposure FLW offers them is worth their money.

FLW also seems to control much more tightly which sponsors they allow to be a part of the tour, leaving more guys to struggle over fewer opportunities.

Again, this is what I've heard from the guys I know who fish the Elites. I can't say if this is the prevailing attitude or not.

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Both tours have advantages and disadvantages but the way BASS cut the number of tournaments and kept the same entry fees was embarassing. The are pocketing the fees for the 3 tournaments they cut and it isnt chump change either. $15,000 each guy donates he didnt last year.

From what I have seen.

BASS-better coverage, best sponsor opportunity, more prestigious

FLW-better payback vs. entries

If you want to be a household name you need to fish BASS but I think they have been doing people wrong since they went to ESPN and became a faceless company.

For what its worth I think FLW carries itself better.

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Both tours have advantages and disadvantages but the way BASS cut the number of tournaments and kept the same entry fees was embarassing. The are pocketing the fees for the 3 tournaments they cut and it isnt chump change either. $15,000 each guy donates he didnt last year.

:-? :-?

Sure about that?

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It is my understanding that they kept the same entry fee per tournament not the total amount.  It is $40,000 for the 8 tournaments not 55,000.  So they are not pocketing the $15,000.  They are trying to save costs for themselves and the anglers by having a little less travel.

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If you haven't noticed this year, FLW has added a few more rules into the mix.

    You can no longer "jackpot" the FLW.    FLW added a rule that prevents anglers from fishing just one tournament.    Wa are not talking about the minor trails just the top pros.

   Its basically the same rule that the Elites have in place.    You must lock in for the whole season.

     FLW's new rule prevents BASS boys from fishing the open.

  AS for the BASS boys that left BASS, the majority left a few years back when BASS was sponsored by Triton, and Triton didn't think it was fair for them to foot the bill and allow other boat manufactures the chance for advertising, mainly, it was Skeeter boys who left for the FLW.    That reason and Busch beer.

       If it wasn't for Triton, most of those Skeeter boys would have never left.     Once Triton stepped down and you are allowed to run your sponsored boat, alot of those guys have tried to re-qualify and some have re-qualified like Alton Jones and Mark Davis.

        The only pros leaving BASS are the one who don't re-qualify after failing to qualify during the season.    

    Ya'll be the judge,   what tournaments gets the majority of threads?

BASS

   What pros get the most threads?    BASS

   Basically, FLW gets talked about when comparing it to who?    BASS

   The threads on this forum say BASS is still the one.  

   How many pros that re-qualifed on the BASS Elite tour left for FLW's?   Name some?

           I know some guys who left BASS due to financial reasons but didn't go to the FLW tour.

    Proof is in the pudding, the pros who did leave, primarilly left when it was Skeeter/Triton issues.

   

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There are many changes coming to or already put in place by BASS that appear to be "squeezing out" the little guy. (No more co-anglers for one) It's all about cash with them...everyone knows that. I don't really hear anyone on here praising BASS anymore. They talk about their favorite anglers, and yes, most of them are in BASS....because of the MONEY..full circle!!!

FLW is still the little guys best chance to fulfill their dream and rise up the ladder if they are skilled enough. Hey, isn't that what bass USED TO be about!!!! ESPN and BASS are sucking the life out of fishing and using it like a blow up doll!!!! BOOOOO!!! to them both!!!!

>:(

ajr

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How many amatuers fishing BFL's can fish in the Bassmaster Classic? 0

There are still co-anglers in BASS opens, and they added more of those this year.  If you think you have what it takes, you can fish in the opens as a pro and qualify for the elite series.  

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