Fishingintheweeds

How does everyone change up their fall topwater bait, retrieve, colors, etc. going into the fall? I know event says fall = spring, very generally, but what are the specifics? Because I get excited about the fall for topwaters but my experience goes more like this; almost all topwaters can catch fish before July, in Michigan...then, mostly only frogs get but for me unless it gets into the evening when the mosquitoes start biting...and I'm always ready for the fall but looking back, I don't think I've caught any topwater fish in the fall... What do you do differently in each season?

"Everyone" says the jig. But does the lure get the biggest bites...or is it the location that it's commonly fished? Seems like a good question.

I don't want to put anybody out there but there is one brand of swim jig that I have, and they're very pretty. I really them...But the head has so many sharp corners on it, they hardly come through at all. It isa almost like throwing a giant treble hook. I threw a 3/8 ball head out and it came through easier than this particular brand of swim bait. I guess my last statement about type and more this about shape, and not just name, is for anybody who may not know or is wondering. I used to not know the difference and wonder if it as really that big of a deal also. Well, it makes a difference. I hope that can be helpful for someone to know.

It does. But it's also helped me improve even more working a jig through tough stuff effectively and practicing not getting hung up. Between the jigs, plain arkie heads and a kinda Neko rig deal I threw together before I knew it had a name, fishing like this lately has also brought me back to crawdad imitations, which I'd never really had a good sense for how to use. In fact, even though I know most fish in most places eat a lot of them, I'd all but stopped using them the last couple of years. I think the shot callers will be good. Until I had mine, I threw an old one that I couldn't tell you where it came from for a million dollars, but the shot caller looks good. I have some of the grass n swim jigs that I just got from them...I'm ready to give those a look soon. For now, I've had the plain arkie head jig heads from them doing good with a craw on. But yeah, comparing all of the jig types that I have, if anybody wonders if certain types really are better in the conditions that they're "made" for, the answer is yes. And the grass jigs come through the grass that most of the others really don't well, or can't without dragging it all in with it.

They just happened to be on the inside edges this time. In the spring, mostly thick pads, they have bit farther out...once July rolls around, I get the pike on the inside edges and a little farther out. But yes, grass specifically, is why I've been picking your brain about the grass jigs. I didn't MEAN to get them out of the thick grass last week but there was grass below that I hadn't seen at first. So, I decided to stay. Ha, the chatterbait did it, right in the middle of it too, but I I figured there might be something a little more suitable. The grass jigs, even the big ones still do ok coming through from the bank. Some of the others though, a couple of different "swim jigs" that I tried, not so much. Grass will probably be what I look to fish and improve on for the rest of this year.

I like the Snagproof Bobby's perfect frog and the Scum Frog (I believe the trophy one), especially for the cost. The Scum Frogs are all reasonably priced. Both of them cast well and neither take on water. I have a Booyah (also very reasonably priced) popper and a Jackal popper...they don't on take water either. They cast ok for being poppers. I haven't actually caught anything on them though, so I can't really comment on what happens after a strike. Everybody has their preferences but I haven't heard anybody have any negative comments yet about these 4. Of the hard baits, they aren't my favorites but I've had the most luck, all sound, on the Heddon prop baits. Either that, frogs or running the Pit Boss (yes, a soft plastic) weightless and retrieving it as a topwater. Because I'm kinda addicted to topwater fishing, I'd love for the other, big hard baits to get me enough fish to comment...but so far, not much luck.

Yes, sir! The more I focus on "grass" fishing, the more I specifically look at the surface to tell me what's going on below. In my mind, that is actually what I'm casting to.

So, you're not really throwing bombs either. Ha, one cast takes long enough as it is. I'm interested in throwing something heavier in the really, really thick stuff, it's just the angles and exit plan..I mean, just thinking of where I was on the river today, for instance, say I throw a 1/2 or 3/4 oz and get something on the end of that cast, through cover, pads and grass. I'm not sure how that one turns out and if I could get them in from there, I'm not sure if I could take the pain of fishing that way. Seems like a fun thing to take on but also a little forced... Instead, I hit the holes in the pads and the inside edges, transitions in the vegetation and near any wood that was piled up. Casts were probably also less than 40 feet and the two I caught were probably less than 20. I used a 3/8 oz, weedless arkie head with a craw on it. Managed two in my lunch break. Seems like the smart way to go about this from the bank. But who knows, the bait monkey may shake me and make me buy some big jigs and then I'll have no choice but to throw them.

Are you fishing from shore this way with the heavier weights? I've got some of my own deals that are pretty painstaking but work in the days they should (I think). Just looking to see what other people's experiences are like who don't fish very vertical because it's nearly impossible from a lot of banks (some spots, sure, but not most). What are you doing with your heavier stuff and how far are you casting?

pfd = "life jacket"

To me, those things are fascinating and also very strange to stand there and look out knowing what bad news is out there. I stand several feet back even from the water. There's no fish or cast worth taking that bath. Say what you want, but I don't even go onto the docks at those places. This particular place had been made into a park and there are a lot of signs that say no swimming and that it's dangerous. There is another similar pond in the rec area that is smaller but has been made into a beach. They have all kinds of diving practices and classes there. One of the guys that dives there regularly said that there are *** drownings there nearly every year. Those guys have also told me the monsters they see down there...but again, even the safe ones aren't really safe. I've contemplated taking my lunch-time fishing back to the river...at least the biggest risk there is getting piked. As for the wacky rig worm, that sounds about like what I was thinking and sure enough, like DINK WHISPERER said, the action is in the spawn and not many other times. It's tough.

I really have no idea...I would say it depends on what's around you in the area that you're fishing (contour, depth, cover). I guess in the right spots it wouldn't be bad. The reason I made this post is to get input from others who've had more luck on these things. For me, in the meantime, I'm trying to rule things out. Both of the fish I had on were on the bottom. One was a decent sized worm on a shaky head and the other was a small crawdad type bait, weighted as a Neko Rig...and since I've been using it, ha, ha, ha...I've found out that I wasn't the first person to do this! I will probably find something that I can try to bring through the middle of the water column now, and try to see if there are suspended fish...and then some kind of obnoxious topwater. I would say do what these guys have suggested for targets and also continue to try to eliminate patterns. This particular spot is in Michigan...but I can't imagine the things that may work would be a whole lot different from what would work in yours. Good luck!

Good points. I THINK there are areas that are shallower that I may be able to reach and not sure how, but I can look for what you're describing. I never even thought about that. There must be some kind of mounds or humps or something SOMEwhere. Ha, ha...this may be a good opportunity to try some of those crankbaits that I never touch because they don't make sense for me from the shore (not compared to other things I could throw). So far, I've thrown a chatterbait, nothing. A wacky rigged Senko, nothing. Some other random rigged plastics, nothing. A shakey head, I did have picked up and run with but I didn't really react because I wasn't really paying attention (I don't think I expected anything in that spot because I've never felt anything there but the drop off/no vegetation. I was just making the rounds). And running a little 3 inch pit boss along the bottom, dragging it, sometimes hopping. I actually saw that fish but it jumped and came off. I do believe that was either IN/on top of the vegetation or between two patches of it. And the chatterbait may have been grabbed in the same area yesterday...it was hard to tell. Other than throwing at the vegetation, I've tried to parallel the drop offs or fish from shore towards and over them. I think I may have been thinking along the same lines. I've heard they're in here but I haven't seen them. I don't know how many there are or if I'm even within 20 casts of them...ha, ha...it's all a guessing and investigation at this point. There are other smaller fish around the bank, yes. And that's a very good point about them suspending. I was debating what depths to try and fish but I may try this next. Either that or my most obnoxious topwaters, on a fly... So far, I've been eliminating spots on the left. Although the upper, left corner, is where I had the one on and the other that I didn't see. The far right LOOKS better but that's quite a hike for me...this is just a lunch time experiment. But I have fished the right side, from that circle. Very briefly. A few casts out and some along the shore.

Where I fish most of the time, there are almost too many river and lake spots to count. I've also realized that there are a decent number of old pits around and I could get to some of these on a lunch break at work or some other times when time is tight. I've checked some of them out a bit and it seems they're pretty typical; 6-10 feet of moderate sloping away from the bank and then they seem to drop off pretty quickly to what "feels" like 15-20 ft. The shallower areas seem to have some vegetation, the deeper areas mostly don't. I have heard/gathered that most are around 30+ years old. They do have fish that I've seen, lost or others have confirmed. Of course, the really great looking spots are completely grown in, around where you'd get to the water...and unless they were specifically cleared on purpose, the whole shoreline has reeds that go out a few feet before hitting the drop off. So, my question is...how do you fish these? Coves or inlets are hard to really get a feel for, if they exist. Points on the shore aren't even necessarily points in the water, they're mostly featureless on the bottom, it seems...some spots you can't get to without a machete and tractor...speaking of tractors, the features that ARE there near the bottom, so I've been told, is old equipment that they couldn't get it before the pits filled... So, I'm having trouble with how I think of these things and my own ideas about them. Are there any solid plans for attacking these or do you really just feel these out over time as you fish them?

Thanks! It's probably just as useful given I am really trying to learn new ways to fish this stuff, casting from the bank. I appreciate the description.

Hmmmm...ha, ha...I left my truck today and took two frogs and the weight of jigs I was using the other day at another spot on this wide, damned-up creek deal...well, I needed to go over this stuff. This is probably the one stretch I've tried to fish that's like that. Well, since I was casting, not even close to vertical, once I got down in it, that was that. I brought in ALL the plants and probably blew up the spot in the process. I'm sure it would've been quite a process getting the fish over that stuff...but at least I know better than to go there with less than a mh...because the medium sure felt a little iffy a couple of times in the past. Note to self, start off lighter if I'm not sure what's out there. Maybe this can save someone else a headache also.

Nice. Looks and sounds very familiar! I actually didn't pick up TOO much with the chatterbait TOO often...but I was able to kind of jig it. The only time I had to start my retrieve as soon as it hit the water was when the vegetation was too thick for the depth. For me, I didn't have to really do very much ripping to free it even to start the retrieve. But yeah, I assume you had to do something similar with the spinnerbait? Did you let it sink and just rip it out to a continuous retrieve? Was popping it up and letting it sink an option? I have never tried to throw spinnerbaits like that. I must be jaded from some old memories of being a kid, not really understanding how they work and snagging them if I let them sink. Which one are you looking at?

I got a hold of some of their chatterbaits and one of the swim jigs. It looks good! The side of me that doesn't have time to fish everything I've already got and can catch plenty of fish with what I already have...still wants to get more of their jigs also.

I should say, who makes it and what is it called?

Yes, I think of it as "shaking off" the grass and bouncing off of anything else. I've figured out that it will come through if I just take it easy, and relax and it will still get bit if I work them right. Maybe it would be worthwhile for me to pick up a punch rig or two and try them out after all.

That's a great question. I've tried. Other things made more sense and when I didn't have luck, I kind of abandoned it. I also was having trouble envisioning how I could use one in some of these places. Ha, very often my fish are coming in with about 12 lbs of all kinds of vegetation in front if them. I'm willing to give it another shot...I know millions of people swear by them! The next time I'm out, I'm going to try and remember this post...but like I was saying, a lot of the times I'm throwing these in conditions where the retrieve isn't continuous. What is it?

Because I'm fishing from the banks, I use a lot of things in ways that are different from what's written in the package. What's the farthest you would pitch or consider casting this kind of deal? What would be drawbacks to this, or things to consider? If I come across a log or some brush in or under pads/weeds, can I work it back to me or am I asking to get hung up (because this rig just does/wasn't designed to come through that)? I ask because I don't have any but they seem like they could be useful.

There are a lot of weeds in a lot of the lakes and river stretches that I fish in. On the river, I cast some parallel to the banks or current breaks, inlets, etc. or go throw a frog or light-weighted plastic on the pads and muck. Fairly often, I'm casting to spots and I am getting the bites and the fish. In these thicker-vegetation areas, I've been getting fish mostly on Texas rig but also chatterbaits (in vegetation yes, to pads or muck, not deep in but still yes). Using these two in these situations seem pretty intuitive to me but a jig, in my mind, might make more sense and open more possibilities. But I just can't quite seem to get any bites on them in these situations. I fish from the banks and sometimes the "shallower" water with lots of thicker vegetation on the bottom (almost always, and sometimes emergent), is basically what I have access to or can reach. I'm totally fine with that but my question is, what kind of jig would you try and throw in these situations? Depending on water depth, I will fish on top of or in the upper part of the vegetation and other times intend to try and get it farther down. Would anyone consider trying to cast a heavy jig and if so...I guess this is back to my original question - which type comes back through the best FOR YOU?

I'm not sure you HAVE to accept losing that much tackle and lures but you will still loose some. I'm not the best guy on here, not by far, but I THINK I've figured some things out and learned a few lessons. Maybe some of them will ring a bell and help you out. You can bump up the line weight for sure and switch to braid. That's kind of become my safe space now. I still use mono for certain situations but it feels so risky to me now. I think really, it's just that using braid has allowed me to become more daring. To me, fishing from the bank requires you to be more creative but especially on rivers, you just have to pay more attention and think. Watch the current and where it's taking your bait and think about how and if there's a way to still get your lure where you want without snagging. Take different angles to cast and take different angles to try and get unstuck by walking the bank and finding other places to work from. Sometimes finding a way to get a little higher can help also. Don't be in a hurry on your initial retrieves, or do, but still try to understand what different things in the river feel like when you hit them or your line is rubbing against them (you will feel that before your lure gets to it, it's kind of a heads up that you're near something you may just bump or may snag on). I think the biggest thing you can do is to calm down and pay attention to what you feel and what you need to do to get unstuck. Same as when you get a knot in your line...you can get frustrated and just pull on it, make it worse, and then have to cut it OR you can slow down and figure it out. A lot of times now, I can get unstuck. In fact, the last lure I lost in a river was a chatterbait and trailer, to a big pike. Funny enough, I'd just been downstream and gotten that same chatterbait snagged in rocks maybe 20 minutes earlier. The last lure before that, that I almost lost, was a $17 Mikey Jr. that I managed to throw about 10 feet up into a tree, 40 feet directly to the right of me. Ha, ha, ha...I blame the dark! I almost cut this one off but walked into the lake some to get a better angle and got it out. I guess it's worth mentioning that most of my main setups have 50 lb braid now.

That's why you bump up the line size. Go whipping that heavy lure on the end of that long rod, on light line and you are asking for trouble. But like others have said, whatever works for you!