RDB

Right…it was my There’s Something About Mary, Franks & Beans moment. My son had to call in his girlfriend before he would help me out. The joy of having 5 boys…my wife doesn’t stand a chance with our humor. I’ll get him back. He’s a teenager…they do stupid stuff all the time.

Ouch…sounds like a case of would you rather.

Sitting on the bed last night switching out some trebles for an upcoming trip. I went to sit up, not realizing that I had dropped a 110 next to me, and buried 2 hooks through my shorts and into the left butt cheek and the other hook through the sheets and into the mattress. I can only tell what’s going on by feel as I can’t see. At this point I am pretty immune to hook sticks but I am literally pinned to the bed, no one else is home, no knife, and the hook cutters are 10 feet away teasing me. I yanked and pulled but gave up and finished my project. A few hours later the wife comes home but she’s not going to touch it, so I had to wait another hour for one of the boys to get home. After a few wire clips, a lot of laughter and pictures, and my inability to coach through 2 failed floss tricks, I convinced them to push the hooks through and I was a free man, none the worse for wear. The only cost was $100 to keep my wife from posting it on her d**n Facebook. Just curious if I am the only one that has brain fart moments. Unfortunately, this experience is called a Tuesday in my world.

This is a personal preference thing. I have an Aldebaran on a NRX and a Z-Bone and they are both great for me. You are looking at a combo weight of less than 9oz and there are other factors that influence…how you hold the rod, tip up v. tip down, living room v. on the water. I personally assign little to no value to the finger balance test and the one size fits all center of the reel seat thinking. On baitcasters, I hold a reel with all fingers above the rear trigger for bottom contact and two fingers in front of the reel while my brother holds with 3 fingers below the trigger. Balance is going to feel different to me v. him. I personally prefer lighter weight combos and have never added weight to a rod. G. Loomis is generally known to have more tip heavy rods but I have a lot of “higher end” rods and I don’t feel any different after a day of fishing whether I am using a Loomis, Steez, or Z-Bone. Anytime you hear something is supposed to be XYZ in fishing, just smile, nod your head, and figure out what XYZ is supposed to be for you.

I’m leery of the thermal info if it is intended to show water temp. The image below is a back pocket on the upper end of a lake I know well and it shows temps from 40-55 degrees. All of the water (~ 100 acres) is less than 4’ deep and protected from north winds. There is no way there is that much variability in temp and I can guarantee there is no 40 degree water and certainly not within 1 square of 55 degree water. Let me know if I’m reading it wrong.

I’ve never heard of it. I compared it to the listed temps on the Texas Parks & Wildlife Dept. fishing reports page and some were spot on and others were off quite a bit. I don’t really trust the #’s from TPWD though.

Any live or rebroadcast tournaments are pretty much must watch for me. However, when the tours make their northern swings and the focus becomes more smallmouth oriented, I struggle to stay engaged. I wonder if it’s that smallmouth fishing in our parts is, for the most part, very limited and therefore more difficult to relate to (at least for me). I’m not dissing smallmouth, they may be one of the funnest freshwater species to catch. I’m just curious if other’s find it more difficult to watch smallmouth v. largemouth focused tournaments.

Fair enough…we obviously are not on the same page based on your XF v. non-XF comment. I’ll accept the blame for poorly communicating and was only trying to address the OP’s question. I’m of the opinion that some H/F rods have more tip than other H/F rods and gave a personal example using rods I own. I’m not talking XF v. non XF rods. There are a number of skipping & pitching rods that are H/F and are specifically designed with softer tips. I’ll leave it there. You obviously disagree that there are differences unless you change power or action and debating is not going to solve either of our positions. As for pro’s, I’m not going to judge their understanding of fishing or rods as I am in no position to judge…their fishing game is likely stronger than mine. Even though they often use flip and pitch interchangeably but I’m fairly sure they know the difference. Anyway, I enjoyed the discussion. Good luck teaching everyone about ERN & AA, you have your work cut out for you when most still can’t accurately describe power and action. The bunny slopes may be a more appropriate starting point but some may do well starting on the black diamonds✌️.

I agree…and I am enjoying the discussion. I think we are maybe misunderstanding each other’s points. I agree with your points above. Remember the OP’s question…why do people refer to a soft tip. This is something you hear pro’s say ALL the time, especially with bottom contact rods. My point is that rods with the same off the shelf specs can have different tip flexes. A “powerful” rod CAN have a softer tip RELATIVE to other “powerful” rods. IMO, that is what pro’s mean when they say they want a pitching rod, skipping rod, etc. with more tip. I also agree that “ more tip” or “some flex in the tip” is a poor descriptor. The problem is I just don’t know how you can have a uniform, objective off the shelf tip measure for rods in the same class. I may be wrong in my interpretation of the meaning behind why pro’s always say this but after hearing and discussing this thousands of times, this is my interpretation of the thinking behind the statement. Edit: I appreciate your knowledge…I too have spent some time dabbling in the rod game. The problem is you are trying to teach calculus when 95% of the class still doesn’t understand basic math (not the people on this board obviously ?).

If you’re asking, he was referring to a rod made by American Rodsmiths and I think it was either MH/F or H/F. The Bryan Thrift rod was a H/F. I just grabbed the first 2 articles that came up that dealt with the OP’s question. I’m likely stating the obvious but XF just means the rod deflects in the upper 20ish% of the rod.

I don’t think we are disagreeing on subjective…almost everything in fishing is subjective. Everything with rod performance is subjective to a degree. Instead of trying to quantify what universal tippy-ness is, just take what he is saying and apply it to you...or don’t. As anglers, we should be good at this. His point is HE believes having some tip matters in a pitching rod performance…Bryan says the same thing and the tippy-ness is not necessarily the same as action. If you disagree that the same power/action rods can’t have different tip flexes, that’s fine. You define what that means to you. If it’s of no value, that’s great. I personally find some value as even though I may not have a concrete formula for tipy-ness, it’s a component I can consider based on my needs. The OP asked what pro’s mean when they say soft tip and IMO, this is what they are referring to.

A soft tip is relative and depends on a number of choices when making of the rod. I have a H/F Phenix Feather (~$150) and it has the softest tip of any rod I have ever used (too soft for jigs IMO). I don’t own Dobyn’s rods but I have tried a Dobyns Fury H/F and I found it to have a soft tip and they are slightly more than $100. Here are a few quotes from pro’s regarding skipping & pitching rods: Bryan Thrift Another important piece is the rod tip. "I like a softer tip to load up when you begin to make a skip," he said. "It will make the bait go much further." Even with a light tip, the heavy action of his signature series rod has the backbone he needs for bigger fish Denny Brauer Regardless of which rod you choose, you need one with some flex in the tip. A little spring at the end of your rod will help you properly present your bait. A tip that's too stiff will cause your pitches and flips to turn into lobs. This will destroy both your accuracy and your distance. The Fitzgerald rods Bryan talks about above are ~$180. You can find softer tip rods in most price ranges. The OP asked a question…it’s a discussion forum ?. I believe the gutter cleaning question is the 3rd post down on the “everything else” board.

I should say they had the identical LISTED power and action which is provided by the manufacturer. Action is basically where the rod bends when pressure is applied. That doesn’t mean the degree of bend will be uniform for every rod. In the picture I have 2 H/F rods (1 Loomis NRX+ & 1 Steez Bottom Contact). You can see the NRX+ hangs below the Steez when I balance above the deflection point. If I move my finger up to the deflection point, they would hang almost identical. The NRX has a softer tip (i.e. more tip) than the Steez. Yet they are both H/F jig rods.

Personally I don’t equate tip softness with action. You often hear anglers say they want a rod with a little tip for certain things (I.e. skipping). They are essentially saying they want a little softness in the tip. Have you seen those anglers fighting a fish and 80% of the rod is barely flexing and the remaining 20% is bent at a 45 degree angle at the tip. That rod likely has a softer tip than normal. I have rods from different companies that have identical power/action and while they both deflect at the same point (action), the amount of flex above the deflection point is quite different. To me, this is something that has to be felt because while there is a rough standard for power & action, I don’t see how you could have one for softness. Not saying my interpretation is correct but that’s how I view tip softness. TLDR: Personally I view tip softness as what happens past the rods action. Action is basically the deflection point. Softness is how the rod responds beyond the deflection point. Different lines of XF, F, MH rods have tips that can behave very differently.

And they would fill up with water because to meet the OP’s $12.99 price max, you can only get half a lure. FWIW I’m a 110 guy too.

Hank Cherry made a couple of dollars in the ‘21 Classic using a Berkley Stunna.

I think the need to Fizz in our area is relatively small and I would bet the majority of our weekend warriors probably don’t even carry the tools to do it. In Texas, I think better livewell management and tournament guidance would help improve survival in many of our club tournaments. Between poor on the water management and club weigh in’s where you see lines of anglers standing at the ramp with bass piled in black bags with 6” of water waiting in line for 30 minutes in 95 degree weather, who knows what the true mortality is. Unfortunately, far too many of these clubs consider dead at weigh-in the indicator of survivability.

Definitely one area where kayak tournaments have a leg up.

Watching coverage of the Bassmaster Elite today and Zona pointed out that John Crews was using Fin Clips on some of his deep water catches. I typically don’t do anything for catch and release but in a tournament, I will fizz if they show some struggle and have never considered clips as an alternative to fizzing. To my understanding, clips don’t solve the underlying problem but it was such a routine comment by Zona that it got me wondering what other’s experience has been.

I guess it depends on how you define master. I’ve been Fishing for 50 years and I still practice all the time. I make up all kinds of situations to break the monotony and my wife loves, loves, loves it when I use her or the cat as targets as they walk around the house. I do these types of things all the time but have never done the Wesley Strader trick in the video as clean as he did.

No desire to pm you and I don’t need drawn out history lesson. I am well aware of the difference between the two and at no point was I suggesting they are one in the same, you made that interpretation. The OP asked about pitching and flipping and when I say pitch/flip, I’m saying you don’t need a specialized rod or reel for either technique. And your right, terminology does matter and applies to your suggestion that I am making something up. I don’t appreciate it and 50 15+ pound bass doesn’t mean your always the smartest guy in the room. And you’re right, the longer this goes, the more pizzed I get. Since you like dissertations, the history of the term making something up comes from the Greek phrase Maka Som Lata. In ancient times a young Greek philosopher met a wine merchant and… Never mind, I’m making that up.

Wow dude…who pizzed in your Wheaties. If you are saying that you need some special one handed disengaging and engaging reel for flipping, I don’t know what to tell you. 99.99999% of pro’s use regular reels to pitch/flip (including Gary Klein). If there was ever a blatant marketing ploy, needing a special pitching reel is at the top of the list. There are only a handful of those types of reels on the market and the acceptance has been low. Andy Montgomery marketed one for Diawa and he doesn’t use it either. Also not needed and the trend is moving away from the super long rods for regular pitching. If someone wants to use a 7’10” rod or 7’2”, it’s personal preference. $100 says I can drop more jigs in a coffee can with my 7’2” that most. I’ve tried both and am much more comfortable with slightly over 7’. To say you need specialized pitching gear is just wrong. Don’t know what to say about this one. I guess thanks for your judgement. The vast majority of rods that people use for flipping and pitching do not have a specific designation for that technique. There actually aren’t many rods that do. My initial inclination was to bite back but instead I’ll just say congrats on your big bass catches and hopefully I can gain some wisdom from some of your posts.

Your call…not trying to talk you into or out of anything. Bottom line is if you have your baitcaster set properly, there is no need to change settings to go from casting to pitching unless you can’t cast without heavy brakes. If that’s the case, you need to practice your casting. Most everyone that is decent at pitching can pick up a rod and both cast and pitch without making setting changes. It’s about the motion…pitching is just a precision underhanded cast. Edit: You need to think of rods relative to the type of bait and cover you are fishing…not pitching v. roll casting v. overhead casting. If you want a bottom contact rod that you can pitch in heavy cover, you probably want a 5 or even 6 power. In less heavy/more open water, you could use a 4 or maybe a 3 power. Rods will also have lure ratings that you need to consider which will also impact the rod’s performance. The term flipping/pitching rod is just shorthand for a rod typically used in heavier cover with heavier line (often braid). As far as reels, you can pitch with a $99 Lew’s or a $700 Steez.

I’m a Steez fanboy and have multiple but for deep cranks, I opt for a Lew’s BB1 Pro over the Steez. I think it is a tough reel to beat for deep cranking at most any price.

I agree with DVT. When people talk about a “pitching” rod, it’s usually just a simplified way to describe a rod for close combat, heavier cover environments. I would suggest reviewing the rods you have now and the types of cover you are fishing and make your decision based on the cover application and not the technique (pitching). The technique of pitching and the need for a pitching rod are 2 different things. Pitching is just a delivery technique, much like skipping or a simple roll cast. You can pitch with pretty much any rod. I may use all 3 techniques in a 10 cast sequence.