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TxHawgs

Punching Questions

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Basically a new technique for me. What's your limit w weight size w tungsten before having hook up problems w the weight blowing the fishes mouth open? Anyone have high hook up ratios w 2oz or above? Do u use a punch skirt? What brands best Lifted, Dirty Jigs? And last, I have all kinds of punching hooks but it would seem to me and some do use EWG hooks as when pulling through thick cover w a punching hook it pushes through the bait often where as the EWG is more weedless. I don't think u get that pivoting hook action from the weight and a snell knot w an EWG though like a punching hook which may be a big deal. Thanks

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You really need to experiment and see what works for you on your vegetation. I rarely use flipping hooks just because it makes a big hole in the fish which makes it easy for the hook to come out of. I throw regular EWG hooks when punching, superline EWG if it's really thick stuff. 

 

As for weight, I've never nor felt the need to punch with anything heavier than 3/4oz. It just works for where I live and what I punch. I've never used a skirted punch weight. 

 

Maybe if I was punching heavier stuff I might move to heavier weights on braid, but I've never needed to. Plus, I dont like the idea of weights on my braid so I use YZH.

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Never had a problem "blowing" a fish's mouth open!

 

Normal range for me is 3/4 oz to 1.5 oz

 

Do not buy into the whole Snell knot theory!

 

Usually if I want a skirt I'll tie on a jig

 

Owner 4X Jungle Flipping Hook

 

 

Owner-JFH-2.jpg

097609_original_1024x1024.jpg

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1 hour ago, Catt said:

Never had a problem "blowing" a fish's mouth open!

 

Normal range for me is 3/4 oz to 1.5 oz

 

Do not buy into the whole Snell knot theory!

 

Usually if I want a skirt I'll tie on a jig

 

Owner 4X Jungle Flipping Hook

 

 

Owner-JFH-2.jpg

097609_original_1024x1024.jpg

I wish I could say the same. I just haven’t done well with a straight shank flipping hook, so I’m not too confident in it. I have stuck to a heavy wire 4/0 ewg and a sizmic punch weight, up to 1.5 oz. I don’t mess with skirts either, I just go to a big jig. The oldhams jig pictured is a great one.

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I don't use a "punch shirt" but I do use Texas Rigged Jigs!

 

 

images (8).jpg

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 I use skirts most of the time but rarely when punching and use a Trokar TK 130 for all punching and flipping in moderate to heavy cover. 

 

The heaviest weight I use is a 2 oz but most of the time a 1 1/2 oz. is enough.

Also, I snell for all bottom contact presentations regardless of the cover, and "blowing" the mouth hasn't been a concern. 

 

 

 

 

Mike

 

 

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Definitely use a snell knot. Much better hook up ratio and you’ll lose fewer fish.

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23 minutes ago, ETX92 said:

Definitely use a snell knot. Much better hook up ratio and you’ll lose fewer fish.

 

I don't Snell nothing & my hookup ratio is in the upper 90 percentile range.

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I also never use a snell knot, and I don’t lose very many fish. I think some of the things we see online have been pounded into everyone’s head for so long that it’s now “ the only way it can be done”. I’ve tried just about every technique out there and sometimes it seems if you keep it simple, you’ll do just as well as if you use what everyone else thinks is the only way to do it. But if your confidence with a snell is great, I say go for it, it just doesn’t doesn’t improve my experience enough to worry about. 

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12 hours ago, Beetlebz said:

You really need to experiment and see what works for you on your vegetation. I rarely use flipping hooks just because it makes a big hole in the fish which makes it easy for the hook to come out of. I throw regular EWG hooks when punching, superline EWG if it's really thick stuff. 

 

As for weight, I've never nor felt the need to punch with anything heavier than 3/4oz. It just works for where I live and what I punch. I've never used a skirted punch weight. 

 

Maybe if I was punching heavier stuff I might move to heavier weights on braid, but I've never needed to. Plus, I dont like the idea of weights on my braid so I use YZH.

So u use fluoro? I will be punching heavy stuff so I need braid. Floating hyacinth and heavy coontail.

10 hours ago, Catt said:

Never had a problem "blowing" a fish's mouth open!

 

Normal range for me is 3/4 oz to 1.5 oz

 

Do not buy into the whole Snell knot theory!

 

Usually if I want a skirt I'll tie on a jig

 

Owner 4X Jungle Flipping Hook

 

 

Owner-JFH-2.jpg

097609_original_1024x1024.jpg

I've heard and thought about the jig instead of a punch skirt. Guess I could use a jig in the coontail but I think a EWG punch rig would come through the coontail better? And forget the jig for punching floating hyacinth right? Catt, aren't u from TX, do u punch floating hyacinth or pads?

3 hours ago, Mike L said:

 I use skirts most of the time but rarely when punching and use a Trokar TK 130 for all punching and flipping in moderate to heavy cover. 

 

The heaviest weight I use is a 2 oz but most of the time a 1 1/2 oz. is enough.

Also, I snell for all bottom contact presentations regardless of the cover, and "blowing" the mouth hasn't been a concern. 

 

 

 

 

Mike

 

 

Skirts most of time but not punching, then what for I'm confused lol.

8 hours ago, Catt said:

I don't use a "punch shirt" but I do use Texas Rigged Jigs!

 

 

images (8).jpg

So this is one of those punching weights a punch skirt then u just tie an EWG hook on and whatever bait u wanna use? Brilliant!!

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I use strike king slither rigs 1/2 oz to 1.5oz. I change the skirts to boss skirts with the keepers for rattles. I like the trokar tk 130 flippin hook surgically sharpened. 

20170502_092803.thumb.jpg.40000f505465cdefebc67810aad0e8e1.jpg

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The smell knot for me is most about protection of the knot.  This is most critical when using flourocarbon, I don't want the weight hitting the knot, on braid unless the weight is sharp most likely means nothing.  I don't use punch skirts often and if I want a bigger presentation I use a bigger bait.  Lots of differences between where your doing this and deep south like Florida has the thickest weeds.  I have not fished there and those that do would have the best insight.

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@TxHawgs

When I say "rarely for punching" understand that the majority of my punching is in 3-4 fow with a 1-2 ft thick mat of hydrilla, for that a skirt does me no good.

When punching through blown over reeds and other vegetation, a skirt is an advantage because it's in more "open"water throughout the process. 

 

Both senarios call for different lines types and strength.  

 

 

 

Mike

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I usually start with 1 oz, and then go heavier as needed. I prefer Gamblers baits for punching. They are durable, catch fish, and enter and exit the mat better than most baits. BB Cricket, and the Why Not are my favorites. I usually have 1 setup with a Why Not and and a punch skirt, and a setup with just a BB Cricket. Reins and Hawg Tech are my favorites weights for lunching. 

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4 hours ago, Catt said:

 

I don't Snell nothing & my hookup ratio is in the upper 90 percentile range.

We all have our preferences. I prefer to snell my knots and feel it works better for me. Also don’t have to worry about the braid coming out of the hook eye.

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1 hour ago, ETX92 said:

 Also don’t have to worry about the braid coming out of the hook eye.

 

If ya using a quality hook & jig the hook eye is welded or epoxied shut!

 

I have no problem with smelled hooks, I just don't believe the hook "levers" in the Bass's mouth or ya get a higher hook up ratio.

 

@TxHawgs

Not all "grass" jigs are designed for punching vegetation!

 

Below is a Siebert Outdoors Grass Jig, notice the position of the hook eye.

 

I want my the eye of my jig slightly above horizontal to the hook shaft (if I'm wording it right). 28° is what I prefer, 30° max., 5/0 straight shank round bend, somewhere around .062 wire diameter.

 

A lot of guys ask, "why not just use a Punch Rig?".

 

Having the weight attached to the hook falls differently than a Texas Rig. And yes a Punch Rig is just a Texas Rig on steroids!

IMG_20180708_215844.jpg

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Hack explains it way better that this dumb Cajun!

 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Catt said:

 

If ya using a quality hook & jig the hook eye is welded or epoxied shut!

 

I have no problem with smelled hooks, I just don't believe the hook "levers" in the Bass's mouth or ya get a higher hook up ratio.

 

@TxHawgs

Not all "grass" jigs are designed for punching vegetation!

 

Below is a Siebert Outdoors Grass Jig, notice the position of the hook eye.

 

I want my the eye of my jig slightly above horizontal to the hook shaft (if I'm wording it right). 28° is what I prefer, 30° max., 5/0 straight shank round bend, somewhere around .062 wire diameter.

 

A lot of guys ask, "why not just use a Punch Rig?".

 

Having the weight attached to the hook falls differently than a Texas Rig. And yes a Punch Rig is just a Texas Rig on steroids!

IMG_20180708_215844.jpg

No u said u use TX rigged jigs but the pic just looks like regular punch setups?

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2 hours ago, TxHawgs said:

No u said u use TX rigged jigs but the pic just looks like regular punch setups?

 

OK got ya!

 

Those in that picture are actually 3/8 oz & were made back in the 80s.

 

A little history 😉

 

It stared for me back in the 70s when I use to make lures, one night I decided to stuff a bullet weight into a rubber skirt. It was so difficult I gave up after only making a half a dozen. This little trick when paired with a craw worm won me many a tournament.

 

Scott's Marina on the Texas side of Toledo Bend is a one room building, a small wharf big enough for a couple jon boats, and a launch. Scott sold Community Coffee which is the #1 coffee of Cajuns and why I hung around. He had maybe a dozen packs of worms, 4-5 spinner baits & traps.

 

On one particular morning I notice some new lures lying on the counter, I picked one up & the little card read "Big Red's Flying Jig". Inside was the lead head of a spinner bait, a skirt, & a 3/0 offset hook with a hitch hicker attached. I bought em all!

 

This was the perfect answer to putting a skirt on a bullet weight!

 

Later I found Barlow's Tackle sold just the weights and then Cyclone Lures made a Slip-n-Jig.

 

You can now find them up to 1.5 oz under various names!

 

But it's still what we call a Texas Rigged Jig!

 

 

IMG_20170902_062609.jpg

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I sometimes use a skirt, and others i dont. Most of my flipping is done with 65#braid and a palomar knot with a 4/0 tk130 trokar hook. 

 

When i use a skirt, i use a seperate wire tied punch skirt from sieberts, i dont buy the skirted punch weights. I feel like it keeps my options open. I can use it or not, and its quicker on color changes, Most importantly of all, its much cheaper. I only buy the bare weights i would use anyway, and a handfull of skirts, instead of skirted weights in each weight, and each color skirt. 

 

I tried the snell knot, but found it kind of a pain to tie and pull up tight on the tk130's bait keeper. Went back to a palomar i can tie in a few seconds, and have not noticed a diffrence in hook ups. Its just a convenience more than confidence thing for me. 

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20 hours ago, TxHawgs said:

I've heard and thought about the jig instead of a punch skirt. Guess I could use a jig in the coontail but I think a EWG punch rig would come through the coontail better? And forget the jig for punching floating hyacinth right? Catt, aren't u from TX, do u punch floating hyacinth or pads?

 

Your #1 consideration is they type of vegetation 

 

Coontail is fairly fragile (breaks easily) & punches with lighter weights.

 

Water hyacinth & lily pads can be almost impenetrable, requiring heavier weights.

 

I'm Cajun & live in southwest Louisiana

 

I lived in Texas for years & spent most of my life fishing both states.

 

 

 

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Lily pads are the bane of my existence come mid to late summer. Even if I get a heavy enough weight to punch them, I pull a bunch out by the stalks trying to get my rig back out. That's about the toughest thing to fish here, I stick to frogs on it, swimbaits and swimjigs near it, and Texas rigs next to it. 

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50 minutes ago, Catt said:

 

Your #1 consideration is they type of vegetation 

 

Coontail is fairly fragile (breaks easily) & punches with lighter weights.

 

Water hyacinth & lily pads can be almost impenetrable, requiring heavier weights.

 

I'm Cajun & live in southwest Louisiana

 

I lived in Texas for years & spent most of my life fishing both states.

 

 

 

Alright last ? What would u suggest for the hyacinth? Punch rig or jig?

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3 hours ago, TxHawgs said:

Alright last ? What would u suggest for the hyacinth? Punch rig or jig?

As thick as they are here right now.....Punch rig weighted with a cinder-block.

 

I prefer punch rig for hyacinth.

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