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FishingBuds

who's still flying?

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lol. Only for work when necessary. I would never let my kids fly. Something about having to choose between having someone stare of my kids naked on a screen (trusting they are not recording which has already been shown to be untrue), or allowing someone to rub them down more intimately than their doctor does for a physical exam, just does not sit well with me.

However, we demand 100% security all the time, and really what else can they do? They will never get it 100% secure, it is impossible. With all the people and all the medical conditions out there that complicate it, there are going to continue to be nasty tales as well.

On the other side, how tough is it for a terrorist to load a colostomy bag or Insulin pump with some liquid explosive? Then we'd all be on here yelling at security for not figuring that out.

The sad part is, we just need to accept the world we live in today carries the risk of some maniac blowing up your plane. If we are going to continue to demand the level of security we are calling for, scanners and pat downs are going to become the least of our worries. I mean what happens when they decide to insert these explosives into their body cavity? What does the pat down to prevent THAT look like?

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The sad part is, we just need to accept the world we live in today carries the risk of some maniac blowing up your plane.

This is the world that we've lived in for decades.  The risk of it actually happening is so small as to be basically zero.

Also, the TSA is a joke.  Their security is designed to make it appear that their doing something when in actuality they provide little security at all.  As an example, my wife has a metal rod in her tibia (broke it falling of the ice) and she's been through the airport METAL detectors 4 times and the metal rod was never detected.  This isn't a small bit of metal either.

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Because arriving at my death safely is my sole purpose in life....no matter how many liberties I have to give up along the way. ::)

SAFETY SAFETY SAFETY

SAFETY SAFETY SAFETY

SAFETY SAFETY SAFETY

SAFETY SAFETY SAFETY

SAFETY SAFETY SAFETY

God the naivety of people in this country is sickening.

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lol. Only for work when necessary. I would never let my kids fly. Something about having to choose between having someone stare of my kids naked on a screen (trusting they are not recording which has already been shown to be untrue), or allowing someone to rub them down more intimately than their doctor does for a physical exam, just does not sit well with me.

However, we demand 100% security all the time, and really what else can they do? They will never get it 100% secure, it is impossible. With all the people and all the medical conditions out there that complicate it, there are going to continue to be nasty tales as well.

On the other side, how tough is it for a terrorist to load a colostomy bag or Insulin pump with some liquid explosive? Then we'd all be on here yelling at security for not figuring that out.

The sad part is, we just need to accept the world we live in today carries the risk of some maniac blowing up your plane. If we are going to continue to demand the level of security we are calling for, scanners and pat downs are going to become the least of our worries. I mean what happens when they decide to insert these explosives into their body cavity? What does the pat down to prevent THAT look like?

Agree, but I have read that the Israel's are the best at airport security, They invest in Dogs, and Their airport security are EX-military which are already trained.

They use no machines supposedly. I do believe this to be true because when the chief of TSA was asked why not try the way Israel does it, he replied "we will not, America will not profile people" so it has to be true now ::)

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yeah and what happened when they did tighten the airline security? These folks just went to soft targets like buses or lobbing rockets into the cities.

We can try and try but we will never make the country terror proof. I can think of half a dozen targets near me that would kill hundreds of not thousands and would be no trouble at all. Not going to name them cause I am not into giving bad people ideas but lets just say we will go bankrupt as a nation trying to secure everything.

The only options, accept stuff will happen and as US citizens, keep your eyes open for things out of place.

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I fly all the time.  I went through the scanner.  I figured whoever saw my somewhat, kinda, sorta, nakedish outline probably lost their lunch! LOL!

That said, I've already had enough x-rays in my life to start worrying about the cumulative effects.  So I might opt for the pat downs from now on.

As for security in general - yep, there's a ton of other "soft targets" that are just as damaging without all the hassles of targeting planes these days.  It's just like preventing theft.  The goal is to make yourself a less appealing target. But you'll never thwart the determined crook.

That said, people are very willing - too willing - to give up freedoms and rights all in the name of "security".  Just look back in history to Germany in the 1930's.  History repeats itself.

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Once they see my  junk, I won't be allowed on the plane! I'm carrying a lethal weapon... At least, that's what she said...

Anyway, all joking aside - Scan me, I don't care. I don't have anything to hide. If they all want to get a laugh and or sick at my image, I'm glad I could make their day!

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That said, people are very willing - too willing - to give up freedoms and rights all in the name of "security". Just look back in history to Germany in the 1930's. History repeats itself.

Agreed 100%. 

I have to fly for work and have been through the body scanners twice now.  I may just start opting out for the "fun" of it.

I don't know that I could imagine a worse job.  Getting to "feel up" random members of your own sex all day sounds particularly exciting.  And you get all that fun for ridiculously low pay.  SWEET!!!

I've written all of my congressmen regarding this issue and would urge everyone else to do the same.

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Anyway, all joking aside - Scan me, I don't care. I don't have anything to hide. If they all want to get a laugh and or sick at my image, I'm glad I could make their day!

Please don't be apathetic about this issue.  You may not care that your rights are being violated, but many other people do.  Particularly parents of young children who are being forced to go through these scanners and/or "enhanced" pat downs.  What are we supposed to say to our children who ask why this stranger is allowed to touch them in places where no one but their doctor should?

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A life lived in fear is a life half lived.

- Anonymous

You bet I'm still flying and so are my kids.  Any security measure at an airport I view as a mere minor inconvenience, not as a breech of my privacy or loss of any freedom.

I have been to Israel several times and planning another trip in 2011.  People there are not hung up over any security measure, they welcome it with open arms.  Once landed one feels safer there than being in a major U.S. city.  No question about having many terrorist attacks there but the people know that's their price to live where they choose.

The topic is about flying , and if one is uncomfortable in doing so, then don't!

Glenn is right about Germany, my in laws were not allowed to leave Germany, in fact not until the liberation ( 1945), I won't say what they went thru but most have heard.......talk about losing freedoms.

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Anyway, all joking aside - Scan me, I don't care. I don't have anything to hide. If they all want to get a laugh and or sick at my image, I'm glad I could make their day!

What are we supposed to say to our children who ask why this stranger is allowed to touch them in places where no one but their doctor should?

Put them through the scanner so they aren't touched? I'd rather have the extra layer of security than have some terrorist load up with explosives and walk onto a plane.

I understand your concern though and I don't mean to poke fun at the issue so I apologize for that.

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I have been to Israel several times and planning another trip in 2011. People there are not hung up over any security measure, they welcome it with open arms. Once landed one feels safer there than being in a major U.S. city. No question about having many terrorist attacks there but the people know that's their price to live where they choose.

And yet they don't use random "enhanced" pat downs or body scanners.  Strange isn't it?

"I don't know why everybody is running to buy these expensive and useless machines. I can overcome the body scanners with enough explosives to bring down a Boeing 747," Rafi Sela told parliamentarians probing the state of aviation safety in Canada.

"That's why we haven't put them in our airport," Sela said, referring to Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion International Airport, which has some of the toughest security in the world.

Sela, former chief security officer of the Israel Airport Authority and a 30-year veteran in airport security and defence technology, helped design the security at Ben Gurion.

...

Behavioural profiling also must be used instead of random checks, he said.

"Having a random search at the airport is like Russian roulette," said Sela

http://www.vancouversun.com/travel/Full+body+scanners+waste+money+Israeli+expert+says/2941610/story.html

The topic is about flying , and if one is uncomfortable in doing so, then don't!

Actually the topic is not about the actual act of flying at all, it is about the new security measures that have been put into effect as of 11/1/10.

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Anyway, all joking aside - Scan me, I don't care. I don't have anything to hide. If they all want to get a laugh and or sick at my image, I'm glad I could make their day!

Please don't be apathetic about this issue. You may not care that your rights are being violated, but many other people do. Particularly parents of young children who are being forced to go through these scanners and/or "enhanced" pat downs. What are we supposed to say to our children who ask why this stranger is allowed to touch them in places where no one but their doctor should?

The kids are really what bother me. I mean, I am an adult, there are worse things I go through at the Doctors office than in security. However, my kids are a different story, being the father of 4 girls, I am severely sensitive to ANYONE even looking at them weird much less  scanning images of them without clothes on or rubbing them down. Don't get me wrong, I do not think anyone in the TSA is getting some sick thrill out of it, I just do not feel anywhere near comfortable having anyone doing those things to my children.

But, this is the US and I have a choice, so needless to say this is one family who will never be vacationing anywhere out of driving distance of NC.

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Put them through the scanner so they aren't touched?

A scanner that emits radiation?  Not the healthiest choice for young children. 

I'd rather have the extra layer of security than have some terrorist load up with explosives and walk onto a plane.

If only it provided this so called layer of security.  The security is an illusion and always one step behind.

So, my choices are to expose my kids to radiation and having their "nude" images viewed by strangers OR having them touched inappropriately by different strangers?  And I have to make this choice so you (the collective you not you personally) can enjoy an illusion that the TSA will catch every single instance of someone trying to bring down a plane? 

Why should I have to endure a KNOWN harm so that you can be saved from an EXTRAORDINARILY UNLIKELY risk?  Should we ban guns to protect people from the unlikely event that an accidental discharge will result in someone's death?  No we shouldn't because that wouldn't be commensurate with the risk involved.  Which is the same as the above discussion.

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I went through metal detectors all the way through High school....I'm kinda used to it,so it doesn't really bother me.

However i do question how well they work,many kids still got guns and knives through regardless of them.No matter what there is always security risk anywhere you go.I just live my life...but a little extra security helps keep a peace of mind...for many people.

It's still a big question mark how much is too much..it's a fine line for everybody.

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I went through metal detectors all the way through High school....I'm kinda used to it,so it doesn't really bother me.

I don't think anyone cares about the metal detectors. We're talking about the new stuff. The new body scanners (take everything out of your pockets, face the side, hold your arms above your head type of scanners) and NEW pat down procedures (these changed on 11/1/10 to include shall we say "sensitive" areas).

Metal detectors are fine and are not invasive.

THIS is invasive.

An ABC News employee said she was subject to a "demeaning" search at Newark Liberty International Airport Sunday morning.

"The woman who checked me reached her hands inside my underwear and felt her way around," she said. "It was basically worse than going to the gynecologist. It was embarrassing. It was demeaning. It was inappropriate."

The TSA said it shouldn't have happened, but it did.  Is the line of prudence really outside of the underwear vs inside it?

Cathy Bossi, a long-time flight attendant and breast cancer survivor said the TSA made her take off her prosthetic breast.

"She put her full hand on my breast and said 'What is this?' I said 'It's a prosthesis because I've had a breast cancer,'" Bossi said. "And she said, 'You'll need to show me that.'"

A video of a father taking his young son's shirt off so he can be searched has gone viral online with nearly half a million views in just three days.

When asked if she would submit to a pat-down, Clinton said: "Not if I could avoid it, no. I mean, who would?"

All quotes taken from this article 

http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/tsa-responds-passenger-outrages-underwear-search-happen/story?id=12208932

There are many more instances of this happening.

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My travel agent - who is almost 80 years old was stripped down to her underwear and patted down.

I was absolutely enraged when she told me about what happened to her and how demeaning it was. What the hell is this place, Nazi Germany?

I think people are finally waking up to the realization that in order to preserve their rights they're going to have to stop being so d**n apathetic.

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Half the people are screaming "We need more security!" while the other half are screaming "How dare they take away my rights!"

I know! We can have airlines without any security measures whatsover and people can sign waivers saying that they won't hold the airline or government responsible for whatever happens to them. I guess you can tell which camp I am in.

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My travel agent - who is almost 80 years old was stripped down to her underwear and patted down.

I was absolutely enraged when she told me about what happened to her and how demeaning it was. What the hell is this place, Nazi Germany?

I think people are finally waking up to the realization that in order to preserve their rights they're going to have to stop being so d**n apathetic.

That is so fecking wrong I can't even think of what to say about it.

What we need, rather than to stop being apathetic, is stop being so bloody politically correct.

Our official stance seems to be that we will not do profiling. How do you spell bull? Profiling occurs every day.

The Israelis have it right. It's not how you search. It's WHO you search. We know what these people look like and how they behave, and it's way past time to start looking in the right direction. Don't like profiling? Call it something else.

We seem to like acronyms, so let's have another.

Intelligently Directed Intense Observation Tactics

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The sad part is, we just need to accept the world we live in today carries the risk of some maniac blowing up your plane.

This is the world that we've lived in for decades. The risk of it actually happening is so small as to be basically zero.

Also, the TSA is a joke. Their security is designed to make it appear that their doing something when in actuality they provide little security at all. As an example, my wife has a metal rod in her tibia (broke it falling of the ice) and she's been through the airport METAL detectors 4 times and the metal rod was never detected. This isn't a small bit of metal either.

Don't hold your breath on that statement.  There are MANY school shootings that NEVER hit the news.  There are MANY prevented terrorist attacks that go unreported to the public as well.

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Don't hold your breath on that statement. There are MANY school shootings that NEVER hit the news. There are MANY prevented terrorist attacks that go unreported to the public as well.

Last I checked, my kid took the bus straight to school.  Haven't seen him board a plane to get to school yet.  And since he hasn't you're changing the subject for some unknown reason.

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SirSnookalot has the idea.  "If you don 't like the pat down, then don't fly." ;)

I don't fly because I'm a big, scaredy cat.  But if I did, I wouldn't worry about the patdown.  I would be more concerned about the recruitment of terrorists who have easy access to the plane, like the pilot.

Terrorist don't always look like what you "typically" think they look like.

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Don't hold your breath on that statement. There are MANY school shootings that NEVER hit the news. There are MANY prevented terrorist attacks that go unreported to the public as well.

Last I checked, my kid took the bus straight to school. Haven't seen him board a plane to get to school yet. And since he hasn't you're changing the subject for some unknown reason.

I'm not changing anything.  Perhaps I misread your post, but you said  "This is the world that we've lived in for decades.  The risk of it actually happening is so small as to be basically zero."

I used the school reference just to show you that more goes on in our country than the general public knows about. 

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