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naturalnbama

pitching/flipping with spinning reel

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This maybe should be in a different part of the forum under tackle tips or tactics but I fish primarily for smallmouth so here goes.   I posted yesterday about my new experience with the fat ika and it got me thinking about pitching / flipping with spinning gear.   I practiced some today in the yard and again was amazed how well the spinning gear shot the bait out with no backlash issues at distances.  With spinning gear the rod is alredy in the right hand and with the added feel of being able to hold the line with my index finger it just seems sooooo natural to pitch this way.  I was pitching along a rock wall in 10-14 feet of water so the normal flip with my baitcasting gear was either too short or if I tried  to give extra line I got a bad backlash.  

What am I missing?  why doesnt everyone pitch/flip this way?? or do they and its just a well kept secret??  I know I cant be the first to try this method and love it.  Lets talk about it and share some thhoughts and tips on flipping and pitching with both spinning and baitcasting geat.

Natural

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What kind of baitcasting gear were you using? I don't have any problems flipping/pitching with quality b/c gear, especially something as heavy as an Ika. I do have some low end stuff on my deck that I can't pitch with. I feel that I'm better able to control the lure with my thumb lightly on the spool to make adjustments if I need. With a spinning setup, once it's off, it's gone. I have right hand ret. reels, so I just pitch it with my left hand if I'm flipping several times per minute, but I'm a little more accurate with my right hand, so I've toyed with the idea of a lefty ret for flipping. Also, I don't have a beefy enough spinning setup to handle yanking fish out of grass, which is where I do most of my flipping, pitching.

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It's easier to make a very quiet entry with a casting rod because you have more control and can keep the bait closer to the water

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With practice you can be as good spinning or baitcaster. Woo Daves use to seminars on pitching with spinning. With Power Pro it's even easier to pitch for largies.

If you get good at both switching between spinning and B/C with the same bait will completly change your presentations. At times this is hugh advantage for both smallies and largies.

Garnet

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I pitch all the time with my spinning reel. I think people choose and that is the key word, casting gear over spinning because:

1) They think it is more accurate to cast this way -- I disagree with this inasmuch as to say that they just need more practice. Or maybe when this is said by anglers, they are correct that they are better with a casting reel because they do not pitch with a spinning reel! With enough practice, pitching can be done with the same precision as casting gear.

2) It is far more convenient -- I agree with this more. With a spinning set up, you have to open up the bail, then close it manually and ensure you have no slack on your side of the bail, then cast. With a casting reel, you just press down the button and cast away.

As I mentioned, I pitch with my spinning rig (drop shot) and what I like about it the most is that I get a more vertical fall than I would when casting the same setup.

So there is give and take using either reel to pitch baits. Glad to see you have discovered that pitching with a spinning reel is kind of cool in its own way. 8-)

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First thing is first, the point of flipping and pitching is for silent entry at short distances, so for one you really shouldn't need to pitch or flip beyond 40 feet, which any well tuned quality baitcaster can handle, if it's beyond that then that is when I'm casting side arm or underhand to stay low, and overhead for long casts with cranks, spinners and top water.  The extreme disadvantage i find with spincasting is in order to stop or slow down the line your only choice is to reach up the rod and grab it or stick your index finger into the line as it's spinning off creating sudden stop and unaccurate pitch, imo.  Baitcasting is as simple as learning your reel's breaking system and backlash control and finesing with your thumb, nothing beats it IMPO.

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I think if you take a pro who's amazing with both casting and spinning gear, he'd say casting gear is more accurate, both for pitching and for long casts.  It may not be so for someone who's not proficient with casting gear, but the fact that your thumb is directly on the spool gives you more control than you could possibly have with spinning gear (even if you control the line with your left hand when casting spinning gear).  For the same reasons, I believe it's possible to make a much quieter entry when pitching with casting gear than with spinning gear.  That's actually something I've worked on all year - making a really quiet entry with my casting gear, especially with roll casts and while pitching/flipping - and I've found it to be more effective than with spinning gear, and I still have a long way to go.

Think about the cast - with casting gear, the bait doesn't sling off the rod immediately like with casting gear when the line leaves your finger.  Basically, it's a smoother transition at the start of the cast, kind of like flooring it in first gear vs. second gear in a car.  That smoother transition I believe is part of the reason that someone who is equally proficient with casting and spinning gear will be more accurate with casting gear.

Of course, you can't beat spinning gear for skipping and certain finesse presentations, but each method has advantages, which is why it's important, or at least useful, to get good at both.

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I think if you take a pro who's amazing with both casting and spinning gear, he'd say casting gear is more accurate, both for pitching and for long casts. It may not be so for someone who's not proficient with casting gear, but the fact that your thumb is directly on the spool gives you more control than you could possibly have with spinning gear (even if you control the line with your left hand when casting spinning gear). For the same reasons, I believe it's possible to make a much quieter entry when pitching with casting gear than with spinning gear. That's actually something I've worked on all year - making a really quiet entry with my casting gear, especially with roll casts and while pitching/flipping - and I've found it to be more effective than with spinning gear, and I still have a long way to go.

Think about the cast - with casting gear, the bait doesn't sling off the rod immediately like with casting gear when the line leaves your finger. Basically, it's a smoother transition at the start of the cast, kind of like flooring it in first gear vs. second gear in a car. That smoother transition I believe is part of the reason that someone who is equally proficient with casting and spinning gear will be more accurate with casting gear.

Of course, you can't beat spinning gear for skipping and certain finesse presentations, but each method has advantages, which is why it's important, or at least useful, to get good at both.

I completely agree except with the skiiping part at the end, i can skip baits beauitfully under trees right up to the bank when needed just as well with baitcasters asa i can spiining reels, it just takes practice and patience, don't stress over it.  It will come.

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Yeah I've tried maybe 5 times to skip with a baitcaster, and it just doesn't seem like it's worth the trouble.  Even the best baitcast skippers can't skip as consistently accurately or as delicately as someone with a spinning rig, especially with soft plastics, which is pretty much the only type of bait I ever skip.  

Kudos on being able to skip a baitcaster though, it is really difficult, or at least it seems very difficult to me.

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Yeah I've tried maybe 5 times to skip with a baitcaster, and it just doesn't seem like it's worth the trouble. Even the best baitcast skippers can't skip as consistently accurately or as delicately as someone with a spinning rig, especially with soft plastics, which is pretty much the only type of bait I ever skip.

Kudos on being able to skip a baitcaster though, it is really difficult, or at least it seems very difficult to me.

Well, I'm with you, but there ARE some guys than can do everything with a baitcaster!

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I started out with my abu garcia 5500C the silver one on a 6 1/2' mh/h casting rod.  the flipping was going ok the problem came when I went to deeper water and wanted to go beyond the original flip and have the ika take the extra line so that it fell straigt down the rock wall as much as possible.  maybe my "antique" bait caster as my son calls it isnt right for the job.  can some of you guys tell me what baitcasting reels your using??

At least I can see Im not the lone ranger with my spinning gear.  I would love to learn to pitch with a baitcaster if I could learn to avoid the backlash.

Natural

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I started out with my abu garcia 5500C the silver one on a 6 1/2' mh/h casting rod. the flipping was going ok the problem came when I went to deeper water and wanted to go beyond the original flip and have the ika take the extra line so that it fell straigt down the rock wall as much as possible. maybe my "antique" bait caster as my son calls it isnt right for the job. can some of you guys tell me what baitcasting reels your using??

At least I can see Im not the lone ranger with my spinning gear. I would love to learn to pitch with a baitcaster if I could learn to avoid the backlash.

Natural

The only thing that separates you from getting there is quality, focused practice. You'll be there soon enough. Better quality reels do make it easier. Something in the Citica class on up will help you learn this very quickly.

As for taking off the extra line, that is just how it is with a baitcaster, and one thing a spinning reel smokes a bc reel.  The latter does not need to have lone stripped to attain a more vertical descent. The only thing I can see to circumvent the more vertical descent is to pitch with a heavier weight.

The bc reels in my stable are:

Shimano

Curado 201 BSF

Curado 201 DHSV

Cardiff 301A

Pflueger

Trion

Abu Garcia

5 Star (round reel)

The first four reels pitch superbly for 1/4 oz on up, with the Trion being finicky. The Shimanos have no problem at 1/4 oz.

The Abu, well, let's just say that darned thing had better be at fairly heavy.  ;D

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about the skipping...

we skipped a lot of docks at the state tournament on Lake Nagawicka here in WI. I never put down my baitcasters for that. I would go so far as to say that spinning rods were obsolete (for me) if it wasn't for shakey heads, drop shots, and hair jigs...I throw everything else on a baitcaster. Even senkos and flukes.

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I agree with you guys on all that except wacky rigging. One time i loaned my brother on spinning rod and started throwing a wacky rig on baitcaster and had no probelm with bait weight or backlashing i just hated the "feel" or really the lack of it. When i pitch or flip with a spinning rod i usually under swing in to spots. 90% of my time with a spinning rod is all underhand. I do this by just swinging it like a pendulum and letting go of the line when i want it is pretty easy

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