46 minutes ago, Dwight Hottle said:

The Daiwa BG is a good choice by the Daiwa Certate would be better. It has a sealed rotor & line roller with magnetic oil that seems to take a lot of wear & tear without any drop in smoothness or durability. Best quality for the money I have found. I have 6 of them. All my bait casters are Shimano so my first recommendation is based on using most of the Shimano spinning reels before I tried the Certate. 

Man I loved my Certate perhaps more than any other reel before it started acting up.  I've had more problems with that reel than any other one I've owned.   

 

I sent it off to DVT, but it's just never been the same.   Not the fault at all of DVT, but now I'm stuck with a reel that feels about 60% of the smoothness it had out of the box.  

 

If anybody knows a true expert on Certate reels I'd love to have them look over my reel.   It's a JDM reel so I haven't tried to send it back Daiwa.   

 

I sure do miss having that reel at a 100%, it was amazing when it worked right.  

Sent it back to Daiwa.

I am an Abu man but I can say one thing for sure the new Revo X spinning reels are about the crappiest design ive ever seen in a spinning reel.

I just got it a few weeks ago, but so far I’m loving my Daiwa Kage 2500. It feels really well built and is super smooth. Nice and light too 

Van Staal is the obvious answer. 

29 minutes ago, Tim Kelly said:

Van Staal is the obvious answer. 

my friend bought one of those for Striper.   it was ridiculous.  you had to manually flip the bail closed which is okay.  but the thing didnt cast great, wasn't smooth.  I have seen it once, and only once.  he never brought it out again.  we dont even talk about that reel anymore.   I think he is embarrassed he spent the money.    I tried it and it felt weird.  like it oscillated when you reeled it.  like it was out of balance.

There are reels that are designed to be a pleasure to fish, with smooth operation and light weight.  Some of those reels can handle a fair amount of abuse before they lose that buttery feel and or fail.  This incorporates most of Shimano and Daiwas designs.

Then there are reels that are designed for 1 purpose, and that is to work literally in the surf.  Being dropped on rocks, cranked in sand filled water and fighting fish in heavy current.  Van Stahl and ZeeBass are legit waterproof reels, designed to work all season in conditions where a Stella or Certate wouldnt last an hour.  The compromise is that you don't get the buttery smooth operation and lightweights that you would with most Shimanos and Daiwa.  Heavy sealing will tighten up the reel

There are reels that kind of bridge the gap between a waterproof reel and a precision reel.  The Spinfisher and Slammer are good examples as is Saragosa, but Shimano doesn't make a Gosa in small sizes.  These reels aren't waterproof, but they're close.  All the ingress points have an effective physical seal.  They can take spray, splashes and even withstand short period under water without water getting into the gearbox or past the AR clutch.  Penns are also fairly simple and easy to work on by yourself.  Parts are readily available at relatively cheap prices.  The drawback to a SF or Slammer IMO is the weight.  The 2500 SVii and Slammer are in the 12oz range when spooled.  An Svii or Slammer wont stack line as well as a worm geared Shimano like Stradic, but line management has improved considerably.   

I think you would be surprised at what at the amount of abuse some reels will take.  Fuego got a little Fuego 2500 I bought in 2018.  That little reel has literally caught over 1000 fish up and down the east coast in fresh and salt water.  I've accidentally run into stripers over 20lb a few times, have had dozens of 50+ snapper and or cocktail blue days on the beach.  Its been dropped on the jetty a couple times, smacked on bridge railings and sprayed with sandy water in the wash, but never completely dunked....yet.  That reel still works and sits on a 7'1 ML F Tatula that rarely leaves my Jeep.  Granted, it doesnt run like it when it as new.  The bail isn't as crisp and the operation isnt as smooth, but it still serviceable.  I didn't expect it to last more than 1 or 2 seasons once I started using it on the beach.  Obviously, mileage may vary, but I suspect that a Stradic or Saltist Back Bay would do well.  Saltist BB is a sleeper in Daiwas lineup.  Its essentially BG with much better components and higher end features.  It has the super solid metal body of BG, but it has a big AL main gear, which holds up better than the zinc gear in the lower end Daiwas and it has magseal.  Saltist Back Bay is one of the smoothest operating reels at its price point, its very close if not, equal to Stradic.

If you want to go with a full waterproof reel, Van Stahl offers a budget reel that's about 9 ounces in the VR 50 and can be submerged completely.  The sealing isnt as good as the higher quality VSs'.  While it can be submerged, I wouldn't recommend cranking it underwater like a VSX. Although it is an entry level reel for VS, it will run 500$ or more, where as the other VSs' are much closer to 1k.

The only IPX6 water resistant reels I know of that are made in the size you want are the Penn Slammer and Spinfisher.  These reels can handle being sprayed, splashed and dunked in shallow water for very short periods of time.  These reels aren't as rugged as a VS, but more rugged than Daiwa/Shimano.  They're not as smooth as a Daiwa/Shimano, but with proper care they run a little more free than a VS.  While they don't manage line as well as a Japanese designed reel, the line lay issues Penn had in the past are mostly resolved, so long as you don't overfill the spool.

Not the current Shimano FX but the previous ones with the quick fire plastic trigger thing. I think new ones are all over ebay still. 

The most bulletproof reel I've ever used. Sure it's not fancy and only $19 but I have some that are 15 years old and never been cleaned. I had some from the mid 90s that almost made it 20 years. One finally died when I went to flip the bail with the trigger and the bail and rotor just grenaded in my hand. They're like the AK47 of reels. 

34 minutes ago, msgf91 said:

Not the current Shimano FX but the previous ones with the quick fire plastic trigger thing. I think new ones are all over ebay still. 

The most bulletproof reel I've ever used. Sure it's not fancy and only $19 but I have some that are 15 years old and never been cleaned. I had some from the mid 90s that almost made it 20 years. One finally died when I went to flip the bail with the trigger and the bail and rotor just grenaded in my hand. They're like the AK47 of reels. 

Are you talking about this reel ❓

Believe I bought it in the mid 80's and still spinning.

3 hours ago, Darth-Baiter said:

my friend bought one of those for Striper.   it was ridiculous.  you had to manually flip the bail closed which is okay.  but the thing didnt cast great, wasn't smooth.  I have seen it once, and only once.  he never brought it out again.  we dont even talk about that reel anymore.   I think he is embarrassed he spent the money.    I tried it and it felt weird.  like it oscillated when you reeled it.  like it was out of balance.

Auto bail trip is the most unnecessary, detrimental feature on small reels today.  Most good reels over 4k or 5k are manual.

VSs' aren't made for smooth operation; they're made to work.  If you don't what you're doing and just assume the most expensive reel is going to be the smoothest/lightest, you're going to be disappointed.  The lack of free spin is due to heavy sealing   IME the biggest issue I had was line management.  Most guys used heavy mono with them early, and when everyone switched to PP suddenly people had issues with the much thinner dia not stacking well.  The issue was taken care of, but it was a serious problem for a little while.

Some of the models used counterweights opposite the pickup.  Without the counterweight the rotation will feel out of balance.  

 

2 hours ago, GetFishorDieTryin said:

Auto bail trip is the most unnecessary, detrimental feature on small reels today.  Most good reels over 4k or 5k are manual.

VSs' aren't made for smooth operation; they're made to work.  If you don't what you're doing and just assume the most expensive reel is going to be the smoothest/lightest, you're going to be disappointed.  The lack of free spin is due to heavy sealing   IME the biggest issue I had was line management.  Most guys used heavy mono with them early, and when everyone switched to PP suddenly people had issues with the much thinner dia not stacking well.  The issue was taken care of, but it was a serious problem for a little while.

Some of the models used counterweights opposite the pickup.  Without the counterweight the rotation will feel out of balance.  

 

Well I guess I didn’t know what I was doing.    Thanks for setting that straight 

1 hour ago, Darth-Baiter said:

Well I guess I didn’t know what I was doing.    Thanks for setting that straight 

I didn't mean to infer you personally didn't know what you were doing.  Reading it back comes off as rude and it wasn't my intention to offend at all, I apologize.

  It's a very common misconception many anglers less familiar with those kinds of reels.  When I worked on the island, nearly everyday during the summer someone would come into the shop and ask about VS because they looked great and were the most expensive egg beater we had.  I would have to explain why the reel didn't have a bail, why it didn't free spin like most other reels, and why righty models were so rare.  VanStaal distinguishes the reel by which hand you reel with, unlike other companies which adds to confusion when people would order them in the offseason.  Essentially it just boils down to function over felt precision.   

VS was designed and built for use in the surf and the earlier models really reflect that.  You either ran the reel as is or bought a conversion kit for the bail.  As far as the rotor being that out of balance, a missing counterweight or pickup would be my best guess especially on a new reel.  Some of the older models may have had interchangeable rotors like ZBs with different pickup layouts and options, but as far as I know they have they have been phased out for some time.

Seriously. No offense.  I didn’t understand that reel at all.  Not one bit.  It casted awful for Me. 

On 4/23/2025 at 5:21 PM, Bird said:

Are you talking about this reel ❓

Believe I bought it in the mid 80's and still spinning.

Sorry for the delay in response. The FX ones were not as fancy as your reel. Here is what mine looked like