@Motoboss begin here

The problem is package BFS reels were aimed for stream trout.  I've never owned one - the closest I've come is two BFS-mod small-frame Ambassadeur, and one of those is a bench CT surf reel that will cast 1/4-oz plug 200'

Skip the package stuff, and take advantage of the aftermarket spools made for 34-mm Daiwa, especially Zillion.  Then you'll be fishing PE#1.2 and #1.5.  

My friend Dave, whom I mentioned in my first post, began with Alphas Air, because it's package, and there's a big YouTube library fishing it for Gulf-cost inshore.  

On 7/17/2025 at 9:48 AM, PhishLI said:

Do yourself a favor and skip the so-so SLX/Curado BFS. Wish I had. Pick up the ARK BFS instead which clobbers both (IMO) and competes directly with the Alde BFS (IMO) and may actually be better due to the range of adjustment and definitely regarding touchiness. Hard to believe? Believe it.

Ark Fishing Gravity Limited Edition BFS Casting Reels | Tackle Warehouse

 

Would you consider this reel better than a Daiwa with an aftermarket BFS spool?  I've got 2 or 3 Daiwa BFS spools.  One that I plan on putting in one of my Airy Reds and one for a Steez.  Not sure about a 3rd spool (or if I have a 3rd).  Want to try BFS with a baitcast reel, but don't really want to invest in another reel as I already have more reels than rods.

 

On 7/17/2025 at 10:30 AM, redmeansdistortion said:

The Morrum ZX 1600 Mag had the potential to be a hell of a BFS reel had Abu been competitive with Daiwa and Shimano.

I had good luck with a 1600C Black Max casting a small unweighted fluke directly into the wind.  I've always felt that I had better control with it than my Morrum 1600 and 1601 Mag SX reels.  I admit that I've only trained myself down to #5 Shad Raps (3/16 oz.) and will never be as good as you or many others here with light lures.

 

I don't want to go more than about 3 BFS baitcasting outfits.  I have 2 rods rated down to 1/16 oz. and an Ace Hawk Double UL/L plus several rated down to 1/8 oz. (which I doubt I'd try a BFS reel on).

7 minutes ago, new2BC4bass said:

I had good luck with a 1600C Black Max casting a small unweighted fluke directly into the wind.

I have a BFS spool coming for a new old stock Black Max 1600C I bought a couple of months back.  The spool maker is in Vietnam and does outstanding work.  I should've had it by now, but it has been tied up at the Detroit post office since June 24th.  The same guy also made me a split shaft shallow spool for a 3500C I'm converting to semi direct drive.

8 hours ago, HawkeyeSmallie said:

 

Thanks for the suggestion, but I already know what I want.

 

To me, it's the most beautiful reel I've ever seen. Not kidding, it's like a piece of art to me.

 

 

Most beautiful? I don't know about that.😆

2 hours ago, redmeansdistortion said:

I have a BFS spool coming for a new old stock Black Max 1600C I bought a couple of months back.  The spool maker is in Vietnam and does outstanding work.  I should've had it by now, but it has been tied up at the Detroit post office since June 24th.  The same guy also made me a split shaft shallow spool for a 3500C I'm converting to semi direct drive.

I'm guessing one of his spools would cost me more than I paid for the reels.  

The simple math is this reel 

is light years from where it began.  Designed to cast 3/8 oz with marginal reliability using centrifugal + end-tension and a lot of thumb.    

 

Now it's lighter weight, and will cast 3 g past 150' with total reliability - 100% backlash-proof.  

It's a bench jewel that began with a good-buy 45-y-o workhorse - it will still be out-performing new reels 45 years from now.  I'm not going to do this because the parts cost more than the reel - hmm

3 hours ago, new2BC4bass said:

I'm guessing one of his spools would cost me more than I paid for the reels.  

When you're building out a reel for BFS, especially a reel that wasn't BFS to begin with, you'll sometimes spend more than you paid for the reel.  I paid $105 for my new old stock Black Max, the spool was $60.  The prices on them have been climbing the last few years.

Finding the VN custom-spool maker was a good move by @redmeansdistortion.  

Probably our biggest loss recently is AMO no longer accepts US IP address or orders.  

 

You can still order Roro from Hong Kong - their post is cost-effective and slow-boat.  

Also, SDS Customs in Ukraine stocks a good range of BFS spools on ebay.  

I haven't seen Avail prices going up, US$ is still strong against JY, and Hedgehog Studio is still a good option for Avail parts.  Thailand vendor Delta Fishing (AOR on ebay) is the best source for Ray's Studio, though waiting on a new batch of parts - they always sell out, with strong markets both in Japan and US.  

10 hours ago, bulldog1935 said:

The simple math is this reel 

is light years from where it began.  Designed to cast 3/8 oz with marginal reliability using centrifugal + end-tension and a lot of thumb.    

 

Now it's lighter weight, and will cast 3 g past 150' with total reliability - 100% backlash-proof.  

It's a bench jewel that began with a good-buy 45-y-o workhorse - it will still be out-performing new reels 45 years from now.  I'm not going to do this because the parts cost more than the reel - hmm

The beauty of rolling your own.

 

Fishing aside, my biggest reason why I love BFS is the bench tuning process.  Taking something and making it mine and capable of things the manufacturer didn't intend.  That often means spending more money than I paid for the reel itself.  I go in with a plan; a niche I want the reel to fulfill, and build it out from that.  My tackle is very environment specific; whether I'm casting piers, bushwhacking skinny creeks, or plodding along an expansive river.  This is also why I don't "marry" certain reels to certain rods.  I mix it up according to what I'm doing.  Combos don't exist in my world, it is much more refined than that.  I pick the rod and reel that will best lead to success according to the body of water I'm fishing.  Primarily being a wade fisherman, I don't like to weigh myself down with multiple rods and reels.  I need only one, because more than that sacrifices mobility which is antithetical to my run and gun fishing style.

22 hours ago, HawkeyeSmallie said:

 

This rod confuses me.

 

It says UL but can throw up to 1 oz?

 

It's a known typo from MB

19 hours ago, redmeansdistortion said:

When you're building out a reel for BFS, especially a reel that wasn't BFS to begin with, you'll sometimes spend more than you paid for the reel.  I paid $105 for my new old stock Black Max, the spool was $60.  The prices on them have been climbing the last few years.

Originally not necessarily BFS, but I've spent more on repairing and upgrading a reel than the original cost.  I always wanted an Airy Red.  Picked up one that looked great in the pictures.  Went to spool line and couldn't.  My $140 reel wound up costing me $300.  Not too upset as this included upgrades including a 7.2:1 gearset.  AFAIC it's better than new now.  It's the reel I will be putting a BFS spool in (Roro if I remember correctly).

48 minutes ago, new2BC4bass said:

Originally not necessarily BFS, but I've spent more on repairing and upgrading a reel than the original cost.  I always wanted an Airy Red.  Picked up one that looked great in the pictures.  Went to spool line and couldn't.  My $140 reel wound up costing me $300.  Not too upset as this included upgrades including a 7.2:1 gearset.  AFAIC it's better than new now.  It's the reel I will be putting a BFS spool in (Roro if I remember correctly).

Put an Alphas SV105SH worm in there, it's a wider pitch so it tracks faster.  This will help mitigate any line dig with thin braid.  It's the one in the top in this photo.  Bottom is an OEM TD Sol worm which came with the 5.8 gears like your Airy Red.  You'll definitely want it if you're running thinner than #1.0 line.

On 7/17/2025 at 10:07 PM, bulldog1935 said:

The simple math is this reel 

is light years from where it began.  Designed to cast 3/8 oz with marginal reliability using centrifugal + end-tension and a lot of thumb.    

 

Now it's lighter weight, and will cast 3 g past 150' with total reliability - 100% backlash-proof.  

It's a bench jewel that began with a good-buy 45-y-o workhorse - it will still be out-performing new reels 45 years from now.  I'm not going to do this because the parts cost more than the reel - hmm

That reel is in immaculate condition and that’s my favorite color out of the older, original Abu’s. Good picture, you can see the magnetic mod you made, at least in part. 

40 minutes ago, redmeansdistortion said:

Put an Alphas SV105SH worm in there, it's a wider pitch so it tracks faster.  This will help mitigate any line dig with thin braid.  It's the one in the top in this photo.  Bottom is an OEM TD Sol worm which came with the 5.8 gears like your Airy Red.  You'll definitely want it if you're running thinner than #1.0 line.

I thought about doing that to my 1000HD, not sure I’m gonna need it yet, but it had crossed my mind. 

I'm fishing Steez SV TW with AMO spool and PE#0.8 - no line dig even catching snook.  

Jun Sonada says you need increased LW pitch smaller than PE#1, but I haven't had a problem.  

My Silver Wolf has increased LW pitch, and I take advantage of it fishing PE#0.6 working line.  

If you get down to measuring the last 5%, the increased LW pitch costs about that in cast distance.  

18 hours ago, bulldog1935 said:

I'm fishing Steez SV TW with AMO spool and PE#0.8 - no line dig even catching snook.  

Jun Sonada says you need increased LW pitch smaller than PE#1, but I haven't had a problem.  

My Silver Wolf has increased LW pitch, and I take advantage of it fishing PE#0.6 working line.  

If you get down to measuring the last 5%, the increased LW pitch costs about that in cast distance.  

Ive never used an CDM products other than BKK.  A buddy of mine is really into BFS and he says their spools are decent, but I dont think he uses their bearings.  What do you think of Roros bearings?  Do they compare with ZPI?

Roro bearings are excellent (3/8 oz limit) - they have the light-distance edge over the three bearings in my post above, including KTF/IXA double (very close second with higher weight limit).  Roro is in Hong Kong.  (Ray's Studio is in Thailand)

I'm a BKK Fangs nut on my lure-hook swaps.  

AMO's spools (Ambassadeur upgrades and their barstock small-frame Ambassadeur-copy reel) are excellent, though their spool dual-race BB was not corrosion resistant, and I made my own micro-bearing for it using a KTF/IXA 740 micro and a Momo bearing spacer (purple) - Momo bearings suck, but their spacers are handy.   This is my hands-down light-lure distance champ.  The palm-cap bearing is China-made Pixa full-SiN ceramic.  

My Roro X29 spool, which was discontinued, buckled the titanium spindle (likely the reason they were discontinued), and my Silver Wolf got its replacement, Roro X27/34 (photo at top of page), which seems to be a lot stronger.  

Claiming China has a domestic fishing market is inaccurate - everything they make is for export - their quality has gradually improved over decades of copying OP's products.  

right or wrong..I still cringe seeing a bass laying on grass.  that cant be comfortable.

On 7/17/2025 at 4:17 PM, HawkeyeSmallie said:

 

It says UL but can throw up to 1 oz?

Learn to measure CCS and all the mysteries about action and power will be solved.  At least for rods you have in your hand.

I took this with me out to Colorado a couple of weeks ago, fit right in my carry-on no problem.

 

2500C for scale.

 

She's a feather.  Spooled with 50m of #0.8 Seaguar GrandMax x8.

 

I ran it on a Graywolf 4'10" 2-6lb, this made for a very light setup.  I was catching rainbows and cutthroat up into the mid teens range.  Had I brought a longer rod, I'd have went after bigger fish but those freestone streams are a tough wade compared to the sand and gravel bottoms we have in Michigan.

 

The small assortment of lures I brought with me.  Small enough to fit in my pocket.

8 minutes ago, redmeansdistortion said:

I took this with me out to Colorado a couple of weeks ago, fit right in my carry-on no problem.

 

2500C for scale.

 

She's a feather.  Spooled with 50m of #0.8 Seaguar GrandMax x8.

 

I ran it on a Graywolf 4'10" 2-6lb, this made for a very light setup.  I was catching rainbows and cutthroat up into the mid teens range.  Had I brought a longer rod, I'd have went after bigger fish but those freestone streams are a tough wade compared to the sand and gravel bottoms we have in Michigan.

 

The small assortment of lures I brought with me.  Small enough to fit in my pocket.

That’s stupid crazy light! 3.9 oz. That’s not an ABU, wondering the maker..

 

Did you build that rod or hire GreyWolf to build it, I’ve seen his work on the auction site but didn’t see anything like that although he had plenty of blanks for sale. All of that combined is still lighter than a Pocket Fisherman! 
 

Cool rig for sure. 

Just now, F14A-B said:

That’s stupid crazy light! 3.9 oz. That’s not an ABU, wondering the maker..

 

Did you build that rod or hire GreyWolf to build it, I’ve seen his work on the auction site but didn’t see anything like that although he had plenty of blanks for sale. All of that combined is still lighter than a Pocket Fisherman! 
 

Cool rig for sure. 

It's one of the first trout rods he put out after he bought Steffen Brothers.  I bought it 3 years ago.  The blank is his own design, rolled on Steffen mandrels.   It's basically the equivalent of a cut down E-glass 4wt and it has a nice deep flex that keeps the fish well pinned.  The reel is a direct drive Isuzu DD310SSS with an Isuzu Tough Light spool.  It's the only knuckle buster you can buy brand new.  As @bulldog1935, it's a Marhoff on steroids.

and the link to product listing

https://isuzu--reel-com.translate.goog/dd310sss?_x_tr_sl=ja&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc

 

full-ball-bearing Marhoff on steroids.  

 

Here's the same size Isuzu, but with freespool clutch and drag, 

BC420SSS

https://isuzu--reel-com.translate.goog/bc421sss?_x_tr_sl=ja&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc

Here's the schematic to the DD310SSS, simple as can be.

 

23 minutes ago, redmeansdistortion said:

It's one of the first trout rods he put out after he bought Steffen Brothers.  I bought it 3 years ago.  The blank is his own design, rolled on Steffen mandrels.   It's basically the equivalent of a cut down E-glass 4wt and it has a nice deep flex that keeps the fish well pinned.  The reel is a direct drive Isuzu DD310SSS with an Isuzu Tough Light spool.  It's the only knuckle buster you can buy brand new.  As @bulldog1935, it's a Marhoff on steroids.

 

15 minutes ago, redmeansdistortion said:

Here's the schematic to the DD310SSS, simple as can be.

 

 

21 minutes ago, bulldog1935 said:

and the link to product listing

https://isuzu--reel-com.translate.goog/dd310sss?_x_tr_sl=ja&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc

 

full-ball-bearing Marhoff on steroids.  

 

Here's the same size Isuzu, but with freespool clutch and drag, 

BC420SSS

https://isuzu--reel-com.translate.goog/bc421sss?_x_tr_sl=ja&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=sc

Thank you both. Very interesting, very cool. 

3 minutes ago, F14A-B said:

 

 

Thank you both. Very interesting, very cool. 

The reel was designed for top water bass fishing, but they also sell a shallow honeycomb spool for trout which I also bought.  It's a complete hoot to fish with.