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The Bassinator

Why dual brakes?

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Why do the new Revos, Patriarchs and such have the dual brakes?  Its my understanding that most people prefer the centrifugal brakes over the magnetic ones, so why would you need both?

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I believe they help with different parts of the cast. The centrifugal help with the beginning while the magnets slow down the end of the cast or maybe its the other way. i know they do different things.

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Centrifugal = Beginning

Mags = end

Why both? More beginner friendly, some people like the reel and not the brakes it comes with (With dual braking it always has the type you want), and personal preference.

I like Centri//Dual Braking, but really any brakes will suffice.

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Dual braking is great in the wind. Really don't have to worry about it at all. I've never seen my '10 STX backlash... ever. It's just dial it in, and forget it. I never suggest to anyone to get a dual system as their first baitcaster, because it will spoil them, and prevent them from really learning how to control the cast themselves.

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I don't think you can simply lump it into two categories, cent/mag. Some magnetic brakes are simply little magnetic buttons that are moved in and out from the spool. Others have a shield blocks/unblocks the magnets. Daiwa uses a centrifugally activated inducer ring, with pops out at high spool speeds, and is affected by two cylinder magnets, that can be adjusted in and out of polarity.

My personal take? Dual brakes are a gimmick that masks poor design. Pick one or the other, and engineer them well, like the Shimano or the Daiwa system.

Bottom line, if you want the best performance in any conditions, with any braking system train your thumb. If there's wind, 90% of my casts will be directly into the wind.

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Yep, as long as it can be set to completely loose :)

Wayne's right though, for most, getting the spool tension set for the weight of the bait is most critical. Then adjust the brakes to the conditions or your preference.

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I think the only time I use the magnetic braking on my reels is when I'm in heavy wind.  Otherwise it's turned off.  Generally I only use 2 cent pins.  Set the tension knob correctly like mentioned and you're good to go.

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Over the last few years I've had reels with every version of braking; magnetic, centrifugal and dual braking.

They all work nicely if you take the time to learn the idiosyncrasies of each.

I've heard many people say centrifugal braking is much better than magnetic braking.

This is true, if you make an amendment to the statement.

Centrifugal braking is much better than magnetic braking for my casting stroke.

I make the opposite statement. Magnetic braking is better for my casting stroke.

Effective casting happens when all three elements are in balance. Spool tension, brake setting and thumb control.

It is rather easy to tell when one is out of whack.

Is the backlash starting at the beginning of the cast? Increase the spool tension.

Is the backlash forming in the middle of the cast? Increase the brake setting.

Is the backlash occurring at the end of the cast. Learn to use your thumb properly.

I get the best casting performance by setting the spool tension just tight enough to prevent side-to-side spool movement, then going just a tiny bit tighter.

I set the braking so that the line starts to "fluff" up in the middle of the cast.

I use my thumb to feather it down at the end of the cast.

This is what works for me, using my reels, with my casting stroke. Your results will be different. Take the time to figure it out with your gear.

Not every magnetic braking system is the same. They are definitely not created equal. The best magnetic system is Daiwa's MagForce-Z. This is a centrifugally activated magnetic system. The worst is probably the original Revo STX's Linear Magnetic Braking.

Now, about dual braking reels. The standard rap is; the centrifugal brakes take care of the beginning of the cast, then the magnetics kick in and control the end of the cast. This is pretty much high grade fertilizer.

The magnetics do not kick in at the end of the cast. They affect the cast the entire time. Do you really think there is some mechanism in the reels that turn off the magnets at the beginning of the cast, and turn them on later? Come on; where's your common sense?

I had two Pfleugers; a Patriarch and a Summit, both with dual braking. Also had two Johnny Morris reels with dual braking. Each was a little bit different in performance. But they all worked just fine. What I did like about them was I could set the spool tension and centrifugal brakes to cover most conditions, and then dial in a little magnetic control to adjust for wind. Nice!

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I don't think you can simply lump it into two categories, cent/mag. Some magnetic brakes are simply little magnetic buttons that are moved in and out from the spool. Others have a shield blocks/unblocks the magnets. Daiwa uses a centrifugally activated inducer ring, with pops out at high spool speeds, and is affected by two cylinder magnets, that can be adjusted in and out of polarity.

My personal take? Dual brakes are a gimmick that masks poor design. Pick one or the other, and engineer them well, like the Shimano or the Daiwa system.

Bottom line, if you want the best performance in any conditions, with any braking system train your thumb. If there's wind, 90% of my casts will be directly into the wind.

I'm curious what gives you this opinion. I've never seen a dual braking system because I don't own any dual braking reels. What have you seen in them that is suggestive of poor engineering?

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I find the Abu linear mag brake to be a poor braking system for the prices.  The addition of a centrifugal brake makes them more user friendly.  I loved it on my patriarchs at first, the mag is good to have for a quick fix but on it's own, the mag brake is lacking.  Daiwa has magnetic brakes down, shimano has a great 6-pin centrifugal system with the VBS, and quantum has a decent externally adjustable centrifugal system.  Abu did ramp up their mag brakes with the new reels, or at least it seems that way when comparing both SX models.

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I have several of the BPS Pro Qualifiers with dual breaking. I generally set two or three of the centrifugal brakes and adjust the the spool tension. I only add mag breaking when the wind is blowing. I like the way it works. I think Shimano centrifugal or Daiwa magnetic is better than either the centrifugal or magnetic brakes on my PQs respectively. The combination of the two brakes on my PQs are better than either Shimano or Daiwa IMO. If that is a gimmick, it works for me.

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I dont think any braking system is faulty or better than the other. Each system works at different times in the cast. I personally prefer Shimano's centrifugal brakes to mag brakes. I find Daiwa's mag brakes to be absolutely useless. I dont see anything wrong with the Revo's brakes old or new. I think we are lucky to have alot of choice so you can find the system that works with your style of casting. What works for me might not work for you and vise versa.

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Agree with 0119. And I'd add that not all DBS's are the same. I have 3 brands of baitcasters with DBS, Browning, Johnny Morris Gold and the 2010 Premiers. On the Brownings, which are cheaper, older reels now, more gimmick than anything. Always hard to balance them out and you end up with poor consistency. On the JM Gold, it's pretty good. More forgiving, especially in the wind, than the Shimano's with centrifugal brakes that I have (curado, core) with at least the same distance of casts.

AG really has it perfected on the new Premiers, IMO. The system works perfectly in concert, and you can turn either or both completely off, if you choose. What's not to love? They leave it up to YOU to pick the best way to control your casts with either or both types of brakes.

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I believe the short answer to the original question is "Marketing". You don't "Need" both.

As .ghoti points out, magnetic braking doesn't "Kick on" at the end of a cast, but I find that as the spool slows is when their effect is most noticeable. To some degree, I believe the opposite is true of centrifugal brakes, which are my personal preference.

The Daiwa system Jfrancho refers to is unique and arguably the best.

As stated by others here, no system will replace an educated thumb.

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I don't think you can simply lump it into two categories, cent/mag. Some magnetic brakes are simply little magnetic buttons that are moved in and out from the spool. Others have a shield blocks/unblocks the magnets. Daiwa uses a centrifugally activated inducer ring, with pops out at high spool speeds, and is affected by two cylinder magnets, that can be adjusted in and out of polarity.

My personal take? Dual brakes are a gimmick that masks poor design. Pick one or the other, and engineer them well, like the Shimano or the Daiwa system.

Bottom line, if you want the best performance in any conditions, with any braking system train your thumb. If there's wind, 90% of my casts will be directly into the wind.

I'm curious what gives you this opinion. I've never seen a dual braking system because I don't own any dual braking reels. What have you seen in them that is suggestive of poor engineering?

Its WAYYY too much unsprung weight for something that is masking issues from too much weight. Cracks me up---add weight to solve weight issue. Then add creative marketing to make them sound better, LOL. Two is not always better than one.

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In theory, a combination of magnetic/centrifugal braking should give you a better fine tunning breaking, both systems are good, one is better than the other for certain uses/applications than the other, so none of them are completely perfect, the dual break systems is like "hey, why don 't we use both ? " a solution to a problem that doesn 't exist, no breaking system, no matter how "perfect" it is call it magnetic, centrifugal, digital or magnetic/centrifugal is a good substitute for an educated thumb and knowing how much and when to tighten the tension knob.

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Two is not always better than one.

True. But on the flip side, it can be better than one, also.

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I completely agree that a well educated thumb is required to use a baitcaster effectively in all conditions. Pitching in tight spots without good thumb control will not be fun or pretty.  Most of us could get by with no brakes if we had to, and in some circumstances (pitching is one) that may be the best, but understanding how your brake(s) work, and having the reel set correctly sure makes it easier IMO.

Some of us think dual braking is good, some think it's silly. That is true of many things when it comes to fishing equipment and tackle. It gives us something to argue discuss when we can't fish. 8-)

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I think one reason why I like having the dual braking is because I use braid...a lot.  When the wind kicks up, having the little extra help with the magnets makes braid a lot more manageable in strong wind.  There is no replacement for an educated thumb though.  You're a far more efficient caster when you rely on your thumb than if you rely on the reels braking system.

To each his own.  Use what you like and what you're comfortable with.

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I don't think you can simply lump it into two categories, cent/mag. Some magnetic brakes are simply little magnetic buttons that are moved in and out from the spool. Others have a shield blocks/unblocks the magnets. Daiwa uses a centrifugally activated inducer ring, with pops out at high spool speeds, and is affected by two cylinder magnets, that can be adjusted in and out of polarity.

My personal take? Dual brakes are a gimmick that masks poor design. Pick one or the other, and engineer them well, like the Shimano or the Daiwa system.

Bottom line, if you want the best performance in any conditions, with any braking system train your thumb. If there's wind, 90% of my casts will be directly into the wind.

I'm curious what gives you this opinion. I've never seen a dual braking system because I don't own any dual braking reels. What have you seen in them that is suggestive of poor engineering?

Its WAYYY too much unsprung weight for something that is masking issues from too much weight. Cracks me up---add weight to solve weight issue. Then add creative marketing to make them sound better, LOL. Two is not always better than one.

Gotcha. Thanks for the response. I never thought about it that way (in terms of weight) but it seems to make sense.

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Keep in mind, we're splitting hairs about performance.  While I may not like them, DBS reels are certainly fishable.  I still prefer SHimanos bare bones centrifugals and Daiwas Mag V/Z systems.

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I believe the short answer to the original question is "Marketing". You don't "Need" both.

As .ghoti points out, magnetic braking doesn't "Kick on" at the end of a cast, but I find that as the spool slows is when their effect is most noticeable. To some degree, I believe the opposite is true of centrifugal brakes, which are my personal preference.

The Daiwa system Jfrancho refers to is unique and arguably the best.

As stated by others here, no system will replace an educated thumb.

U say Dual Brks are a marketing tool that you don't need both, and stick with Shimano or Daiwa

I think that is so funny because both Shimano and Daiwa spend MILLIONS on marketing, HEG, SUPER FREE, MAGFORCE V, ITO, that is Y a Steez reel costs $479.99 a Zillion $399.99, you are paying for the MILLIONS they spend on marketing.

I just sold  2 Steez reels and 1 ConQuest DC reel for the Dual Brking PARTRIARCH reels !!!!!!!

Retail for $199.00 and they don't backlash and they will out cast any Steez, the DC will outcast the Patriarch maybe 10ft ?? but you have to spend $300.00 more for 10ft !!!!!!

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Wow.  :)

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