Jump to content

Recommended Posts

I have a Shimano Calais 201A and I have play in the spool, with my thumb on it I can move it forward and back. Open the side plate take the spool out and I can put my index finger on the pinion gear and move it left and right. The pinion gear sits in the one way bearing correct? Is that what's wrong? I don't think it's the pinion and drive gear mesh right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The pinon will have some play with the spool out. Is your cent brake knob loose...? Are the shims inside missing?

forward and back (up and down) movement with thumb pressure would inducate a drag issue. 

Left and right(side to side) would mean there is play thag can come from a couple places. Generally when a spool has side to side play the brake knob is loose. Did you lose the shims? There can also be an issue with the seating of the pinion gear. The "one way bearing" would be the anti reverse bearing and has no bearing in spool play as the drive shaft goes through that. The pinion is encompased by a bearing located under the clutch.

Which one is your issue?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's up and down, my drag works fine? With the reel assembled and the spool engaged to reel should I have any up and down movement in the spool? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, iabass8 said:

The pinon will have some play with the spool out. Is your cent brake knob loose...? Are the shims inside missing?

forward and back (up and down) movement with thumb pressure would inducate a drag issue. 

Left and right(side to side) would mean there is play thag can come from a couple places. Generally when a spool has side to side play the brake knob is loose. Did you lose the shims? There can also be an issue with the seating of the pinion gear.

Which one is your issue?

^^^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, TxHawgs said:

It's up and down, my drag works fine? With the reel assembled and the spool engaged to reel should I have any up and down movement in the spool? 

Are you saying there is no side to side play but there is top to bottom play as if the pinion isnt seating on the spools shaft?0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If your tension knob is really loose it can be a cause of side to side play. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, iabass8 said:

Are you saying there is no side to side play but there is top to bottom play as if the pinion isnt seating on the spools shaft?0

Yea no side to side as if the tension knob is loose. I know what that is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd get with DVT on that one, it may need professional help. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm having trouble visualizing what is being described. The Calais is a little tricky to work on. I don't recommend diy on them for the uninitiated. I'll be happy to take a look if you'd like. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Delaware Valley Tackle said:

I'm having trouble visualizing what is being described. The Calais is a little tricky to work on. I don't recommend diy on them for the uninitiated. I'll be happy to take a look if you'd like. 

It's pretty simple, the spool has play in it, not left and right like the tension knob is loose but up and down. I have to get on YouTube but I'm pretty sure the one way bearing is what the pinion gear sits in, if so then it's shot. And as I'm typing this I just remembered that before I knew better I oiled that pinion gear area and oil will make that one way bearing slip. So my question is, do they make a tool to pull that bearing out of the side plate safely?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like Dave, I am also having a hard time visualizing the problem.

Firstly, the roller clutch bearing does not have anything to do with the spool. The drive shaft sits inside that bearing. It would slip if over oiled, so a wipe with a few Q-tips will sort that out. Removing that roller bearing can be problematic. Sometimes they come out easy, other times they won't budge. Had a special tool made for the purpose.(see picture below).

 

The spool is supported at either end by the spool bearings, so unless one of these is missing, or broken, then I can not see any way that the spool will move back and forth, or up and down. 

 

Send it to DVT, and he can sort this for you. Would be interested to hear his diagnosis !

Roller clutch Press 1.jpg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok. I think it's just a matter of semantics. What you call up and down , I would call back and forth. If the AR clutch bearing is contaminated cleaning and proper line should cure the problem. On reels with a pressed in bearing they can be cleaned in place. Don't force them out as the bearing and side plate are sold as one unit. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sounds like normal wear.  Flush and repack the roller with lithium grease, and it should go back to like new.  If you flush and go to oil, I bet it stays the same.  What you're feeling is the pins engaging the the roller tube.  As the lube deteriorates and disperses, they get a little loose.  The tube surface that contacts the pins in the AR bearing also wears a little sometimes, so perhaps that could be inspected by a pro.  It's not a pricey part if it needs replacement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, J Francho said:

Sounds like normal wear.  Flush and repack the roller with lithium grease, and it should go back to like new.  If you flush and go to oil, I bet it stays the same.  What you're feeling is the pins engaging the the roller tube.  As the lube deteriorates and disperses, they get a little loose.  The tube surface that contacts the pins in the AR bearing also wears a little sometimes, so perhaps that could be inspected by a pro.  It's not a pricey part if it needs replacement.

Please confirm that I am reading your post correctly.

You recommend that grease be applied to the roller clutch bearing ? Sure way for it to fail in my humble opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes. Been doing it for years.  No failures. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, J Francho said:

Yes. Been doing it for years.  No failures. 

Thanks for your response.Interesting ! Goes against everything I know and ever read about this subject.

Will try it on one of my own reels to see how it works .

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't over load it.  If you ever had a Daiwa, many come loaded with grease.  As long as the plastic "Y" springs in the roller cage can move, when the roller bearings are engaged (instant anti-reverse), then it won't slip.  A good gold lithium grease or a moly will do well.  Takes some of that "precision" away, but adds buttery smoothness.  I generally went vapor thin film of TS 321 for most guys reels, but some liked the buttery feel.  I like buttery on my moving bait reels. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/5/2016 at 1:10 AM, TxHawgs said:

 I'm pretty sure the one way bearing is what the pinion gear sits in, if so then it's shot. And as I'm typing this I just remembered that before I knew better I oiled that pinion gear area and oil will make that one way bearing slip. So my question is, do they make a tool to pull that bearing out of the side plate safely?

I'm going to assume when you say "one way bearing" you are talking about the AR bearing. The Pinion gear does not sit in this bearing....The drive shaft does.  The spool goes into the pinion gear and not AR  bearing. 

 

2_1.png

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm confused at this point, DVT yes up and down would be correct. I guess it can't be the one way bearing as my handle has no play. As in when I'm reeling and go to go the opposite direction with the handle it stops dead no play. So when I open it up and take the spool out I can take my index finger and put it on the pinion gear and move it slightly left and right which is what is causing the up and down play in my spool. So what's wrong with it guys? Why the movement in the pinion gear and how do I fix it? Thanks in advance guys.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Really hard to say without seeing it. 

Being as the pinion bearing doesnt have a bushing in it like daiwas, is the pinion bearing damaged? Thag bearing houses the pinion so thag would be my first thing to check. Remove the handle aide plate, pull the pinion gear out and remove the 2 tiny screws on the plate and pop it off. Bearing will pop out. Make sure the plastic housing that sits on the 2 posts with the spings is seated correctly . Its a guessing game for us unless you have a small video clip.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So if I can move that pinion gear back and forth than that means the big gear is either moving also or the teeth are shot on the pinion perhaps or the teeth and mesh on gears is ok and perhaps the big gear is spinning on the shaft. OK gonna take it apart, I'm not working so can't afford to send it to someone and I'm pretty mechanically inclined, so wish me luck lol. I'm fixing it to sell it, it's in excellent condition besides this, it basically looks brand new and I'm gonna put it on epay for 200 bucks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, TxHawgs said:

So if I can move that pinion gear back and forth than that means the big gear is either moving also or the teeth are shot on the pinion perhaps or the teeth and mesh on gears is ok and perhaps the big gear is spinning on the shaft. OK gonna take it apart, I'm not working so can't afford to send it to someone and I'm pretty mechanically inclined, so wish me luck lol. I'm fixing it to sell it, it's in excellent condition besides this, it basically looks brand new and I'm gonna put it on epay for 200 bucks.

You haven't tried taking the handle side off this whole time yet....?

No, if the pinion gear is moving, that doesn't mean that the main drive gear is also moving or the teeth are shot. Your reel would be unusable of these gears were moving around freely under the handle side of the reel. The big gear wouldn't be "free spinning" on the drive shaft either unless there's another huge problem. 

The pinion gear sits, when seated correctly, encompassed by the pinion bearing. There shouldn't be much play at all here as the inner race of the bearing will keep the pinion in place. If the pinion is moving freely, you need to make sure the bearing isn't damaged, ruined that the pinion gear is seated in and to make sure it's seated correctly on the two posts under the handle side plate. It is highly unlikely that your gears are missing any teeth or damaged. You would know (unless you aren't telling us something) as the retrieve will be extremely rough. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No retrieve is smooth except when the play like catches up and it makes a noise, hard to explain. But if I keep slight tension on the spool with my thumb while reeling it keeps it from doing it. Do I have to take stuff apart to see if the pinion gear is seated correct? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, TxHawgs said:

No retrieve is smooth except when the play like catches up and it makes a noise, hard to explain. But if I keep slight tension on the spool with my thumb while reeling it keeps it from doing it. Do I have to take stuff apart to see if the pinion gear is seated correct? 

Just take the hande side plate off. Removed handle, unscrew drag star, unscrew the side plate screws and carefully pull the side plate off. Theres 2 springs that sit on two posts in the housing that can get lost if you arent careful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From memory, the removal of the handle side will require you to remove the non handle side too, as there is a screw holding the handle side plate that can only be accessed by removing the non handle side.

It is a tricky process that may be beyond the average tinkerer !

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • fishing

    fishing forum

    fishing rods

    fishing reels

    fishing

    bass fish

    fish for bass
    fish

×