I, like Chug Bug, am getting ready to buy a boat. This thread has some great advice and info. VERY HELPFUL!

I hope I'm not getting off subject but to expand on the information exchange I am curious to know what folks think about the following:

Is it better to wait for winter for a better deal at boat shows etc...  or is now at the end of the season better.

How much mark up is there on new boats? I've always thought that about 10% off MSRP on cars was a fair deal (not counting rebates etc...). How far down can you reasonably expect to get off the MSRP on boats based on your experiences.

Riskkid- I wish I knew the answer to your questions and hopefully someone on this thread will.

I got about a little over 10% off on my last boat and in retrospect probably could have gotten more but was a little impatient to haggle any longer. This dealer had taken me on two test drives and my wife and I one additional time, so he was probably becoming impatient as well.

I believe you could get a better deal in the winter rather than a boat show, although I 'm really just quessing. In this area the boats at boat shows are usually sold pretty quickly, normally the first day of the show. I have noticed the for sale adds in the newspaper also increase in the winter which should cause problems for dealerships as well.

Dealership prices for new cars can be located on numerous web sites but I have never seen one for boats. Maybe someone on this site can educate both of us..................Al

For $22,000, you can buy a 5 year old boat thats max powered, has the bugs worked out (be sure to get the motor checked out by a mech.), and still have money left over to actually use the thing.

chug bug,seeing your post about fishing alone and not needing to speed around the lake sounds like my situation...i bought a nitro a few yrs back and am very happy with it..it's the 640LX with a 60 hp motor,think i spent around $12,000...it goes about 45mph...it does seem like nitro puts the smaller motors on their boats but i the largest lake i fish is around 500 acres and i get around fast enough,i think most of us would like 300hp  motors but how many of us really need them

Howdy All,

I hope my two posts didn't offend anyone. I was just trying to make a point that sometimes a man doesn't need the latest, greatest and fastest, especially when it's his hard earned dollars doing the buying.

I have nothing against people wanting what they want, be it fast boats or race guns, I shoot SASS and IDPA competitions. I have seen the "need for speed" nearly ruin the SASS shooting sports.

Perhaps I mistook some of y'all's input for "keepin' up with the joneses" rather than your experience with boats and motors. Sorry about that. I apologize.

I, on the other hand, just got me a nice little 12' Lowe Sea Nymph with a 9.9hp Merc for my personal excursions on the lake. I have a Regal 2120 but it just isn't a fishing boat. It's my pleasure boat. Funny thing is I started off looking at bass boats and I ended up buying the deck boat....so much for taking your wife with you when you are shopping for a bass boat.

I'm afraid I'd have to think about divorce if my wife was insisting on a .......deck boat....... vs a bass boat.

ugggghh.  

Ya'll keep refering to the need for speed as the reason for not buying an underpowered boat.

One last time, SPEED HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT!!!!!!!!.  What's speed when the boat won't even get on plane with a load in it.

If he ALWAYS fishes buy himself and never carries much of a load in the boat, he might be happy with a 90 on a Stratos 201.   Heck, I recently bought a nice 30 hp Johnson for a little of nothing off a guy's 16' glass boat a dealer sold him.  He fished by himself on a fairly small lake and thought it worked great for what he wanted for almost two years.  Then he started fishing with friend and then the boat would not get on plane with both of them in it.  He took it back to the same dealer he bought it from and they wanted almost as much to upgrade the motor as he paid for the boat, and made out like they really didn't want his boat as a trade in on a new one with that little motor.  He finally went to another  dealer, bought a much bigger used motor, I installed it and gave him a few hundred for his 30.

I think most of us are speeking from the experience of having had an underpowered boat and they are absolutely no fun anytime you want a friend or two along, and they are definetly no fun when it comes time to get rid of it.   The lions share of the money you saved up front buying it with that little motor is going down the tubes when you try to sell/trade it because most experienced boaters wouldn't have it.  Take it back to that same dealer sold it to you (the one that's bragging about what a great package it is right now) and he's gonna give you a rude awakening when he starts telling you the trade in value of your little motored boat.   They are setup that way only to get you on the water at the cheapest possible cost and that salesman will brag about what a great rig it is just to get your name on that contract in his hand.

As mentioned, you can put a Briggs and Stratton in a car and it will get going and probably run the speed limit on flat roads, just don't take it in the mountains.   With a boat it's a little different, it takes lot more power to get it on plane just so you can get going than it does once you get on plane, the heavier the load, more this is so.

Chug Bug, don't take anything I have said personally, I'm not busting your balls. How your boat performs has no effect on me at all. Same for what you purchase. Yes, I have a heavy bass boat that performs well with a large engine. The dealer I bought mine from will not install a smaller engine on this boat because it would cause performance issues.

In reality what you purchase doesn't matter to me at all. You asked for opinions and you got them. I was only trying to prevent you from making a mistake I had already made. I wish you well with your purchase..................Al

Chug Bug, don't take anything I have said personally, I'm not busting your balls. How your boat performs has no effect on me at all. Same for what you purchase. Yes, I have a heavy bass boat that performs well with a large engine. The dealer I bought mine from will not install a smaller engine on this boat because it would cause performance issues.

In reality what you purchase doesn't matter to me at all. You asked for opinions and you got them. I was only trying to prevent you from making a mistake I had already made. I wish you well with your purchase..................Al

Why do you guys insist on thinking that I am not taking your advice? I have not posted ONCE that I didn't believe you and am going to stick with an underpowered motor. A lot of other members are debating this issue with you. Not me. I am not off hand dismissing anybodys advice on this forum, so please don't make it seem like I am being ungrateful for your opinions. GEEEEZ

BTW my post on the how fast can you go thread was a joke.  I think it's amazing that you and way to slow can hit the mid 70's in your rigs.  I did not think that post could have been misconstrued as anything other than fun.

I don't know about either of the boats in question, but would like to ask the "Why new instead of used?" question.  For the $22K you could get a relly nice larger platform.  My 18.5' Skeeter works fine for me and my roommate, but if you try to fish 3 people off of it you have to be careful.  Are you planning to fish solo or with more friends???  (You may find yourself making more friends once you get whatever boat you do purchase)  

A lot of the advice in this thread is good.  Trust me, once you get whatever boat you buy and get it out on the water, sun coming up, a little mist rising above the mirrorlike surface, you will have a big smile on your face.  The best pointers I have seen here are the ones that remind you to be the customer.  If you want to give $22K to a dealer, make them earn it.  Here is a big apples to oranges comparison, but if a new customer comes in to my Hooters and has never tried our wings, I will give him a free wing and a free shrimp (they are awesome) to earn his $12- $15 in business.  Any dealership that wants you to spend more that 1000 times that much should do a lot for you.  There is no way that it will take them 3 weeks to swap out a motor.  I would run away from anywhere that said that to me.  Also, there should be a way that you can test drive the boat.  If they are set on a price and unwilling to negotiate, I would shop around, like a few others have said here, you have what they want, a good chunk of dough and the wish to buy your dream.  Don't be afraid to be the customer.  If they make you happy, you will send them more business, if they screw you, they have made their $ once, and won't get any repeat business from you.  Ask some local people who have bought boats from that particular dealer.  They sound a little shady to me.  

Whatever you do with your $$$$ (You could have paid the $10K for my 95 Skeeter 150ZX with at 150 and still have $12K for a nice used tow vehicle)  I hope that you are one of us, whether fishing from you johnboat, you 24' 300 horse pro boat, or fishing from the bank.................a fisherperson who enjoys spending a day on the lake!!!!!

Think of an underpowered motor the same way as fishing a jig in heavy cover or a carolina rig with a 5'6" medium action pistol grip rod. Can you do it? Sure, and probably even catch a few fish. But its highly inefficient, and much more work than it needs to be. And your likely to not last very long, the motor feels the same way working at 100% open all the time just to get on plane.  

Well Cart,

It was a means to an end...My wife hates fishing, but she loves to go boating with me while I fish. 8-)

It worked out real nice! She's the one who suggested me buyin' my new little fishin' boat. So I bought one.

I am a lucky man!

Chug Bug, I pulled both of them up on-line and like you, it sounds like a no brainer to me. That Tracker is SWEET! Your partners will thank you for the dual console. I have fished a jon boat for the last 20yrs. but Dad has a Ranger that he lets me use whenever. I prefer my jon. I just don't get excited about name brands or monster horsepower. Sounds like you've done your research so get what YOU want. I went thru the same headaches when I was shopping for a truck two years ago. When I finally drove that big 3/4 ton Dodge off the lot it sure was worth all the trouble. By the way...I fought with the dealership for six months before I bought it. Great learning experience but it was a headache. Good Luck

Chug,

I hesitate to even jump in to this thread at this point...

The only thing I will suggest is to take the biggest friend you have along on the test drive. When you lake test, the boat will have only a few gallons of fuel, empty storage comartments, no gear, etc. So even an underpowered boat can feel decent. If you bring a 200+Lb buddy with you & the salesman and fill the livewell, that will at least be close to your average fishing weight. You won't have to wonder if it's underpowered. And don't ease down the lake in a straight line... pretend you are driving a sports car. (within reason)

When I bought my last boat (19' champion) it was rated for a 200hp. So naturally I thought I had to have 200... my salesman was the one who said this boat will perform well with a 175. (and the showroom teaser had a 150 on it) I test drove same model with all 3 motors, the only difference I saw in the 175/200 was a few mph top end, which didn't justify the cost to me but the 150 was clearly not right. And surprisingly the 175 and 200 had no noticable difference in holeshot. With the 175 mine will jump out of the hole better than most boats, handles like a dream, is very responsive and will run fast enough for me. (60ish) Then once I decided the 175 was enough, we took 4 different props out and maximized what the 175 would do. I've carried 5 people in it (and did not unload my gear) and it comes out of the hole just fine and runs/handles well. The moral here is that you do not always need max rated hp... but you need to be an educated consumer and drive the boats in any configuration you are considering.

In contrast:

A good friend bought a 17'champion with a 90 (rated for 150) and with just he and I in it, I have to lay on the front deck to get it to plane. He test drove it with an empty tank, livewell, no gear and a 120lb guy (who actually sat on the front deck "so they could talk" during test) and said it was "good enough for me" since I normally fish alone. Guess what, he has regretted it ever since and can't afford a motor swap or a new boat.

If you take the suggestions in the first paragraph, and make yourself an educated and aggresive consumer, I think you will be very happy, on whichever boat you buy.

Good post Flechero.

I think Chug has enough info now to make a very well-educated decision on what to do next.  Great advice and input.  Just because there isn't a unanimous agreement doesn't mean the advice isn't sound.

Good luck Chug!