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Alec McMillan

Best Knot for Fluorocarbon?

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I just spooled up my new shimano reel with 15 pound Seaguar Red Label Fluorocarbon. This is my first time using fluoro, I have always been a braid man. I was wondering what is the best knot for fluorocarbon and any tips or info I should know. I have used the palomar knot for braid and it has been perfect for me, but I don't know if it will work for fluoro. I would also appreciate some info/tips on using fluorocarbon.

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If I am using straight flourocarbon, I use Zonas shark knot. It has been the most reliable for me.

 

 

If I am using a flourocarbon coated copoly, I use a standard trilene Knot or palomar knot.

 

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I use the pitzen knot for all lines.

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What about the Jimmy Houston knot? Looks almost like that shark knot with a little more hassle. I’m going to try that shark knot. Looks simple

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Stick with the palomar. It's a great flouro knot and it's easy to tie.

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here is a good thread about flourocarbon knots.

 

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I tie a San Diego Jam with fluoro. It's easy and been the strongest knot I've found for it. Type of knot isn't nearly as important as tying it properly though. 

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The best fluoro knot is fluoro not...

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6 hours ago, Bluebasser86 said:

I tie a San Diego Jam with fluoro. It's easy and been the strongest knot I've found for it. Type of knot isn't nearly as important as tying it properly though. 

Ditto 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Mike

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7 hours ago, Bluebasser86 said:

I tie a San Diego Jam with fluoro. It's easy and been the strongest knot I've found for it. Type of knot isn't nearly as important as tying it properly though. 

Good advice here regarding the tying of knots trumps the knot chosen.

 

Denser fluorocarbon lines are just harder to cinch down into a tightly formed knot and the wraps don't embed themselves into underlying line (the part of the line wrapped over) as readily as softer monofilaments. Maybe a decent analogy is trying to tie a simple overhand knot in a thin gauged length of copper wire. Yes, you can do it, but it is hard to pull down to close it all the way.

 

This is, by the way, why it is more important to lubricate a fluorocarbon knot more so than a mono knot: it helps it slide into a tighter formed knot. It has absolutely nothing to do with the line being more subjected to "burning" than mono. It is actually the opposite. *For braid, lubricating a knot makes no difference much at all. When I do it, it is out of habit.

 

Brad 

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You San Diego Jam guys should take a look at the Pitzen.  It is the Jam with one step left out.  The strength is not effected and it is quicker and easier to tie.

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1 hour ago, Jig Man said:

You San Diego Jam guys should take a look at the Pitzen.  It is the Jam with one step left out.  The strength is not effected and it is quicker and easier to tie.

I used the Pitzen years ago and never had an issue. 

But that one extra step for the SDJ is nothing compared to the confidence that the first "locking"  step gives. 

Which btw is what makes it a good knot to use with braid.

 

 

 

 

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

Mike

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13 hours ago, Russ E said:

If I am using straight flourocarbon, I use Zonas shark knot. It has been the most reliable for me.

 

 

If I am using a flourocarbon coated copoly, I use a standard trilene Knot or palomar knot.

 

That is the original braid knot or also known as a double line clinch knot, been around longer then Zona! No knot can resolve knot failures with FC line and the reason so many knots have been introduced. The San Deigo jam knot is easy to tie and as reliable as any knot for FC line.

Tom

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6 minutes ago, WRB said:

That is the original braid knot or also known as a double line clinch knot, been around longer then Zona!

Tom

Isn't he just doubling the line and tying an unimproved clinch? 

I don't know about "gets stronger as you pull on it" but we use this in the salt, and it's been around nameless (kinda like the modified albright) for a long time. I don't like it cause it's ugly, but it works well, the only down side is it tends to collect junk if you are around funky veg.

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33 minutes ago, reason said:

Isn't he just doubling the line and tying an unimproved clinch? 

I don't know about "gets stronger as you pull on it" but we use this in the salt, and it's been around nameless (kinda like the modified albright) for a long time. I don't like it cause it's ugly, but it works well, the only down side is it tends to collect junk if you are around funky veg.

When I first started fishing forums was BASS Insider over a decade ago and listed a link to fishing knots illustrating the "braid knot" because it was the knot I used back in the 50's and still use it for braid. I have referred to this knot as the braid knot on this site.

It's a clinch knot or what called the fisherman's knot, using doubled line, not the improved clinch knot. Most anglers don't like the 3 tag ends. 

Whatever knot you tie do it correctly without overlapping wraps and deforming the line. Wetting FC is critical and using a line dressing is critical. 

Tom

 

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54 minutes ago, WRB said:

That is the original braid knot or also known as a double line clinch knot, been around longer then Zona! No knot can resolve knot failures with FC line and the reason so many knots have been introduced. The San Deigo jam knot is easy to tie and as reliable as any knot for FC line.

Tom

There are several variations of the knot. Shaw grigsby had a version. So does Gerald Swindle. 

The knot zona uses, seems to be the easiest to tie.

He admits he did not invent the knot. He is just the first person I saw use that variation.

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So this Jimmy Houston knot is the same as that shark knot only backwards. Well... kinda.

 

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Captain Hooked said:

So this Jimmy Houston knot is the same as that shark knot only backwards. Well... kinda.

 

 

 

That is a double San Diego jam knot and it's been around a few decades.

Why the pros feel the need to have a knot named after them is the question, none will solve FC line failures. Anyone can see the need to improve knot strength and the numbers of knots suggested for FC line clearly indicates a knot strength problem exists.

Monofilament line is easy to achieve 100% knot strength using standard fishing line knots, not with FC line. 

Palomar knot works with FC when tied without twisting the loop crossing the line. 

Tom

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right I understand that. The most appealing part of FC is that is invisible in the water. If mono had that ability I believe more people would use it.

 

What about using braid to FC leader... that knot binding them together is a hassle as well. I tried the FG knot and while it works good I still fear breakage when going through the guides.

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Bass are not line shy fish. Line stiffness or diameter can and does affect how some lures perform, that is a the factor consider. My catch rate or strike rate per man hour fishing bass fishing didn't improve the 20+ years using FC line instead of premium mono line.

My lost big bass from line failure increased dramatically over that time period and that is the reason I no longer trust FC line.

The only advantage I can add for FC line is it's lower coefficient of drag going through water and heavier weight allowing the line sink in water. The advertised lower refraction of light then mono is true and a advantage for line shy fish like trout, doesn't affect bass. I like FC line for bottom contact lures, but it's like handling a rattlesnake, it will bite you.

Tom

 

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What is your recommendation for mono line then? what is the cheapest line you would get and maybe a middle of the road line? preferable something that can be bought at wal-mart or academy sports. Everyone always talks about Berkley Trilene XL. Any good?

3 minutes ago, WRB said:

Bass are not line shy fish. Line stiffness or diameter can and does affect how some lures perform, that is a the factor consider. My catch rate or strike rate per man hour fishing bass fishing didn't improve the 20+ years using FC line instead of premium mono line.

My lost big bass from line failure increased dramatically over that time period and that is the reason I no longer trust FC line.

The only advantage I can add for FC line is it's lower coefficient of drag going through water and heavier weight allowing the line sink in water. The advertised lower refraction of light then mono is true and a advantage for line shy fish like trout, doesn't affect bass. I like FC line for bottom contact lures, but it's like handling a rattlesnake, it will bite you.

Tom

 

 

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Berkly Big Game, green is inexpensive and available everywhere snd was the mono I used for decades.

Premium FC line is expensive and has better quality control essential for FC line.

Tom

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Every few months this topic comes up, and every few months we get into a discussion about how mono will cure all the ills of world and how flouro is the bane of our existence..

 

Use a quality product and experiment for yourself..I did and use Flouro for all technique's except 2 and do not have the problems many above seem to have. 

 

 

 

 

Mike

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Palomar - now, then and always...braid, mono, fluoro.

 

Best fluoro tip: become a better caster. It will solve most fluoro "issues."

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