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all star or diawa?

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i saw that post about the light and tough and thats a sweet looking rod. looks very comfortable. i had already pretty much made up my mind on that team allstar IM10, but now that got me thinkin.

so, which would be better for light weightlss plastics, jigs, cranks, and spinnerbaits?

also, the light and tough doesnt come in a 7ft MH F, which really sucks. but do you think MH F is a good power for the techniques listed above?

also, the team all star has IM-10 graphite, but the team daiwa only has IM-6 (the lowest), but it claims that the "power mesh" adds sensativity. which is a more sensative rod?

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The same rod you can use to fish jigs, soft plastics & spinnerbaits is not a good grankbait rod in that power & action rating, it 's just too stiff and allow the fish to throw the hooks of a crankbait.

A medium power rod allows you a more versatile approach, even though considered by most as a soft rod for jigs, soft plastics & spinnerbaits the rod has plenty of backbone to drive the hook in if you rig your soft plastics right and your hooks are razor sharp all the time; still, the rod is forgiving enough not to pull the hooks of a crank away.

If you want to go ahead, get the MH and suddenly you begin to experience fish getting unbottoned when hooked on cranks just remember I told you it was going to happen, ok ?.

Rod sensitivity depends on a big bunch of factors, since there 's no standard to measure up things as subjective as sensitivity and because manufacturers use different grades of graphite blends plus different resins used to bond the fibers together it 's difficult to say which rod regardless of it 's IM rating is more sensitive. You simply can not say that IM10 is better from one manufacturer is better than the IM6 from another just because one has more fibers in it.

You cannot determine a materials brittleness from modulus, the same applies to strength, or sensitivity.

Steel can be heat treated to a high hardness, where it's very brittle, or conversely annealed and softened till it's ductile, yet its modulus remains the same

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I can't comment on Daiwa rods, I've never owned for fished one. I can comment on TAS's IM-10 rods. I have several and am very pleased with them.

The one odd thing I've noticed is that AS doesn't seem to subscribe to Fuji's New Guide Concept. They use Fuji guides, but they use fewer of them and space them out further. For instance, my 6'8" rod has 7 guides + 1 tip. My BPS rods have 9 guides + 1 tip.

That's just something I've noticed. It doesn't seem to have any adverse effect. My IM-10s are outstanding rods and very sensitive.

As for lengths and actions, I use 7' M F for cranks (probably not ideal, but works for me), and 6'8" MH F for spinner baits and a 6'6" and 7' MH F. I think the medium would be the best choice for light weightless plastics.

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I been reading a few threads about the L and T rods breaking .Any rod can break but all stars have a lifetime warrenty .I have some AS  rods and i like um they aint new ones though .From what i have  read about the L& T rods they should change to Light and touchy

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I don't think the All Stars have a lifetime warranty.  The higher end All Stars have a 3 year warranty.  I've never broken one, though.  Some of my American Classics have been used hard.

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No Allstar doesn't have a life time warranty, I have a corner full of broke Allstar

rods. But with me it could be a corner full of anything. I still buy Allstar. I haven't bought any of the new one yet. All of mine are the WR1 and WR2's.

Hmmm maybe they are better than I thought. I don't think they have made the WR's in a while.

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thanks for the info every one. Raul, that was very helpful. i guess i would be better off getting a 7ft. M F for weightless plastics.

as for the rods, i think the LT looks more comfortable than the AS what with that specially contoured handle. it looks much more awsome too :)

so i guess the only way to know how sensative a rod is is thru experience right? cuz i always thought the higher the IM the more sensitive. but thats not always true is it?

this is such a delema :-/.

btw, the allstar rod that i'd get has 8 guides + tip, and the daiwa rod just says 7 guides, so im assuming that means 7 + tip, but i dont know.

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Crankbaits are best fished with a moderate action rod not a fast tip rod. Like Raul said, you're going to be losing fish.

If you want a Crankbait / Spinnerbait rod, get yourself the Carrot Stick .

If you want something for weightless plastics then that's another story.

Use your Ugly Stick or whatever for cranks, that's about the only thing they're ok for.

I'd go with the L&T if I had to pick between the two.  But if I was mostly aiming for cranks i'd go with the carrot stick, and for other rods I'd go with my Gblanks! Great custom rods for a great price.

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Allstar might not have a lifetime warranty, but all you have to do is carry them out on Telge road, fill out the form, and they will replace them on the spot. That's in Houston. If you give them a call I bet you can get your rods replaced either through them or a dealer near you.

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yall are right they have 2 diff warrenties a 1 yr and a 3 yr my old wr 1, had a lifetime warrenty that was from 12 yrs ago,Wonder if it is still in affect since shakespeare purchased alllstar,prob why they changed the warrenty  :-?

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I have two L&T's. I'd buy more if I were in the market for another rod.

I posted before that I like a bargain. Of all the rods I have, only three were bought at regular price, and two of them were those two L&T's.

I use the 6'3" casting model for spinnerbaits, jerkbaits and topwaters despite it being a fast action rod. I use the 7' medium action casting model as my "utility" rod. If you told me I could only take one of my rods with me, it would be a toss up between the 7' L&T and a 6'8" Avid.

I really like the handles and reel seats on the L&T's. For me, they're very comfortable, and give a nice sense of security. There's also a lot of blank exposed beneath the reel seat. In their price range these may be the most sensitive rods on the market.

Don't get hung up on th IM or modulus numbers. I'm staring to think it's just marketing hype, or statistics. You know what Mark Twain said; "there's lies, damnded lies and statistics.

Cheers,

GK

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so i guess the only way to know how sensative a rod is is thru experience right? cuz i always thought the higher the IM the more sensitive. but thats not always true is it?

Not really, if you stay within one manufacturer 's IM ratings yes, the higher the modulus the more sensitive and light the rod will be, problem is when you try to compare brand A to brand B from different manufacturer.

For ex with Shimano

Scimitar is less sensitive and heavier than Clarus or Carbomax, they are less sensitive and light than Compre, Compre is less sensitive and light than Crucial and so on.

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Call their customer service regarding broken rods.   They have treated me very well.  

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so i guess the only way to know how sensative a rod is is thru experience right? cuz i always thought the higher the IM the more sensitive. but thats not always true is it?

Not really, if you stay within one manufacturer 's IM ratings yes, the higher the modulus the more sensitive and light the rod will be, problem is when you try to compare brand A to brand B from different manufacturer.

For ex with Shimano

Scimitar is less sensitive and heavier than Clarus or Carbomax, they are less sensitive and light than Compre, Compre is less sensitive and light than Crucial and so on.

ok thanks for clearing that up.

yes i am aware that you dont want a stiff rod at all for crankbaits. i knew that before i made this thread. i guess i shouldnt have listed that as one thing i will use the rod for. i will mainly use it for weightless soft plastics. i do use cranks on my bendy as hell ugly stick and it seems to do a good job w/ cranks.

so you really think that the L&T are the most sensative rods in their class? they do look comfortable. but they have alot less guides than the allstar. does that have anything to do with anything?

also, just how light are they?

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You know what line slap is ?

Line slap is generated when under load the rod bends and the line touches the blank, less guides doesn 't mean it 's bad, less guides means that the rod bends less and it requires a higher load before line slap happens.

Less guides in the real world means that the particular blank in that rod is stiffer than others, other blanks need more guides to stop line slap from happening.

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ok. ive never heard of line slap happening. is line slap a bad thing?

is there a way of comparing the sensativity of two different rods from two different manufacures with out actualy using each of them?

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There 's absolutely no way of comparing sensitivity of two rods, sensitivity is something that could be measured physically ( transmission of vibration ) but there is the all important human factor, we are all different, someone may endure having his leg crushed to pieces while another can 't stand the rubbing of cloth on the skin, that 's why sensitivity is a subjective term to describe a sensation.

Line slap is bad because it generates friction of the line against the blank which causes heat and interferes with the fluid motion of the line. You will never see line slap on a spinning rod when under stress, the line hangs below and away from it, but you will see line slap on the cast, as the line uncoils from the spool the line slap against the blank something that reduces the length of the cast, that is if you use line that holds a lot of memory. Spiral wrapped rods have a lot less line slap than rods with all the guides on top because by the time the rod bends the line is already underneath it.

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It wasn't my intention to suggest All Star is doing something wrong, or the number of guides are too low. I just wanted you to know about it. I have several Team All Star IM10s as well as several American Classics and they are super rods.

By the way, have you considered an All Star American Classic?  They are a wee bit less expensive than the IM10s, but they are still extremely sensitve, and I would bet a little tougher.   I have a 7'6" flippin' rod, 7' carolina riggin' rod, and a 6'6" spinning rod.  They are extremely good rods.  

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the allstar has more guides than the daiwa, so its good in that category.

ugh im so undecided and torn the daiwa looks better and looks alot more comfortable, but im afraid its not going to be as sensative. i even went as far as to make up a pro and con sheet for both rods. the all star came up with an even number of pros and cons, like 5 each, and the daiwa came up with like 8 pros and 3 cons......

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Buy a St. Croix on sale!

::)

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I admire the effort you are putting into this. Seems you will make a good choice whatever you choose.

Have you considered a Fenwick? I have two Fenwick HMGs I got on sale, both under $100. They are killer rods. Maybe a bit more sensitive than the AS IM10.   HMGs have lifetime warranties, too.

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i looked briefly at falcons, but i dont think i looked at fenwicks. im gonna go check them out now :)

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Buy a St. Croix on sale!

::)

Roadwarrior, I have looked everywhere I know of and can't find the avids on sale. Where exactly are you seeing them on sale?

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