Why is it that anglers that were dominant in the '80's aren't competitive in tournaments today? Rick Clunn, Shaw Grigsby, Randy Blaukat, etc. aren't threats to win anymore, yet have more experience than anyone on tour.

Keep in mind the guys you mentioned WERE the KVD's, the Ikes, the Reeses, etc. of their generation. They smoked the generation that preceeded them.

The same fate awaits KVD and the current crop of anglers. Absolutely NO disrespect intended, it's just the evolution of the sport. It applies to just about everything these days. My middle school age daughters take math that I didn't learn until high school.

Somewhere out there is a twelve year kid no one has heard of fishing from a bank. You'll know his name in ten years when this comes up again in a future forum; "What ever happened to......?"

Grigsby, Clunn, Nixon and the rest laid the groundwork for the current ruling class. The cycle continues.......

i think KVD might be the exception...he seems to get better with age lol

2009 Classic Skeet Reese age 40

2009 Blue Ridge Brawl Kevin Vandam age 42

2009 Dixie Duel Tommy Biffel age 52

2009 Diamond Drive Mark Menendez age 45

2009 Battle On The Border Jason Williamson age 28

2009 Southern Challenge Aaron Martens age 37

1st question where are all these youngsters?

2nd question what exactly about bass fishing is constantly changing?

3rd Name me one new technique?

It is easier to start a career in bass fishing today because it is widely accepted as a career back in the 70s no companies outside of fishing were willing to put out money.

Who said only 'young' anglers were winning? I'm not sure where you are getting that. You listed only one angler that was a big name in the BASS Invitationals of the '80s. I'm talking about dominant pro's of the '80s.....why aren't they dominant anymore. That is what my thread states.  As far as why, it's only speculation....I'm just throwing stuff out there.  There are tons of new techniques though....fishing chatterbaits, mainstream use of swimbaits, swimming paddletail tubes, 'flick shake' fishing, etc.  As far as bass fishing changing...I wouldn't even know where to start.  Bass fishing is constantly evolving; I can't imagine anyone would think otherwise.  

....It's kind of like comparing an old football team of the '70s like the Steelers to a current team. They were great back then, but I bet they would get their arse handed to them now days.

;D

Uh huh... :

Give the those guys the same kind of training along with advancements in sports medicine that's available now and they'd wipe the butts of most teams out there now. Great athletes are great athletes, the only difference is the time and era they were great in.

No Way....men are significantly larger than they were 30 years ago. The largest guy on the '75 Steelers line was 275lbs. That would be considered a featherweight in todays standards, where lines average well over 300lbs.  The average height and weight of man has increased since then. Bigger guys, better plays, more black atheletes, etc.  Much larger pool to pluck athletes from as well.  I'm not sure how many guys were playing football in the '70s, but I bet the number has drastically raised since then.  

It amazes me that so many think age has something to do with using the latest and greatest of equipment.

I'm 64 and one hell of a fisherman, but I can't hold a candle to what I could do 20 years ago: 20 years ago, I couldn't keep up with what I could do when I was 24. It's called getting older.

I have to hand it to our older competitors, as I can tell you that the grind of competition in all weather conditions is one major grind. Very few can come close to hanging on over a 4-5 day tourney both physically and mentally. Then to move on to the next grind (tournament?) without a substantial rest. It's not so easy!

The discussion of whether or not fishing requires athletic ability comes up frequently with many judges on either side of the fence. Come out with me for 5 days straight. Then hop in your vehicle and take a 20 hour ride and let's go 5 days straight again. You may love fishing but I think your going to have a big surprise on how physically beat you are no matter what your age is.

These guys do this week after week, month after month. When I was young I thought that there would be no way my abilities would lessen: but guess what folks, they did and yours will also.

Kudos George, I couldn't have said it better myself.

I'm pushing 70, but I have today the same burning passion that I had in my 30s and 40s.

Today, I'm a far better fisherman than I ever was before, and have stayed abreast with every new lure and fishing technique. What I don't have today however is the same indefatigable stamina. Just like George, I was sure that I would definitely be the exception, but age is inevitable and age is humbling. The only way to avoid old age is to die young, and that option never appealed to me.

In his 60s, Roland Martin emerged from denial and announced his retirement from professional angling. Roland said that he was no longer able to compete against youngsters like Mike Iaconnelli. He picked the right guy, because Jersey Ike has enough electricity to light two cities, and he makes more money with TV programs than most tourney anglers make on the water. Though Roland may not have the same endurance, he still has more enthusiasm than most anglers half his age.

Roger

Thanks to Both George and Roger! Roger fished with Moses the first year Greewood Lake was up and running! He's seen it go from drop lines to spears and then rods and reels

Rolo- Roland Martin has my vote for the greatest angler of all time.  He absolutely dominated!  

Thanks to Both George and Roger! Roger fished with Moses the first year Greewood Lake was up and running! He's seen it go from drop lines to spears and then rods and reels Smiley

I resemble that remark > ;D

Rolo- Roland Martin has my vote for the greatest angler of all time. He absolutely dominated!

Bill Dance zoomed to stardom right out of the box (1967), but Roland Martin absolutely dominated the entire 1970s decade, and he got my vote too (darn Clunn). I'm just grateful to have lived during the era when Ray Scott incepted BASS and witness all Roland's remarkable feats.

Roger

The overall competition is better today thus making it harder to win consistently. Also not winning wears you out mentally, and fishing is more mental than physical.

I would say it has a lot to do with competition. Sure they were great back 20-30 years ago, but to the extent that the elite series skill level has increased has been dramatic. Just looking at my own club, every year some new record is broken for heaviest fish, or biggest bag. You can probably see this across the whole bass fishing world. A good bag back 20-30 years ago is not the same that it is today.

Great post. I always think the same thing about other sports. Looking back at hockey would the old players that are in the hall of fame survive today? Probably not competition has just gotten so intense. And with population increasing it is making the world more and more competitive because everyone needs to work hard to become successful.  

Because they sit on tv and tell you how to fish and make millions.Look at bill dance.That dude never has to fish again.Any thing with his name on it,and he waits on the mailman.

I love reading remarks about age and experience from young folks, reminds me of when I knew everything by the time I was 19 and then realized how little I knew when I hit 30.

Now that I am knocking on 60, I realize how much more there is to learn.

I love reading remarks about age and experience from young folks, reminds me of when I knew everything by the time I was 19 and then realized how little I knew when I hit 30.

Now that I am knocking on 60, I realize how much more there is to learn.

isn't that the point of this thread?

Yes, that is why I made this comment on this thread. Maybe I should have put this comment on a Senko Thread??????

Lot of smart young men here, it is fun to watch them go through similar situations and learning progressions

Maybe I should have put this comment on a Senko Thread??????

I have a very old Senko. And it CAN'T outfish the young ones. It's more glue than plastic now -it creaks when it tries to wiggle. Most of the time it can't wiggle at all. I'd retire it but I'm too cheap. And it still has it's good days.

That gets this

You need help Paul

I'm 41 years old and I know there are things I used to be able to do that I can't do these days. Few things (edit to include WITH MOVING PARTS) get better with age and my physical abilities aren't one of them.

That being said, because of experience, there are things I can do now that I couldn't do 20 years ago. I can work on airplanes, cars, HVAC systems, laying ceramic tile, etc.. as well as being 10x more patient.

Because they sit on tv and tell you how to fish and make millions.Look at bill dance.That dude never has to fish again.Any thing with his name on it,and he waits on the mailman.

Bill Dance gets mentioned a lot and I think he is a good example of just how good some of these old guys can be.  In the "Day on the Lake" series in Bassmaster he caught a 15 lb sack under less than ideal conditions.  If you read this series on a regular basis you will realize that very few of those who participate have beat his 15 lbs.  I can only remember two or three with more weight over the last four years and that includes a number of young guns.  I know this is only for one day on an unknown lake with no pre-fishing so it could have just been dumb luck.  However, it could also be that old Bill is pretty good at figuring out an unknown lake after all these years.  Now if you stretched this out over a few days like a tournament then the stamina of youth would probably win out, but that doesn't mean that these old guys don't know as much about fishing or don't have the skills of the younger guys.  It just means that their old bodies and minds can't keep up the pace and the intensity of concentration over a multi-day tournament.

Bass fishing is constantly evolvingBass catching is still the same

Natural, I listed 5 Elite series and the Classic winners none of whom would be considered young in any sport other than fishing. Of the techniques you listed only one the flick shake is a technique the others are lures and none of those are new with exception of the chatter baits and those aren't new either.

Now for the dominate anglers from the 80s who are you talking about?

The closest to anyone dominating ever would be KVD now or maybe Rick Clunn but other than that no one dominates this sport.

One can not compare athletes from one era to the next because there is no way factor in the heart of the athlete.

There are many ways to evaluate professional anglers. For example, you could base it on monetary earnings, total stringer weights,

prestigious awards like Angler of the Year and so on. I've devised my own pro ranking system, which is based on the following:

# of 1st place , # of 2nd place, # of 3rd place, # of Top-10 and # of Top-20.

Based on cumulative scoring, the top tourney pros during 80s decade would look something like this:

EARLY 80s

1> Larry Nixon       Score 64

2> Roland Martin Score 56

3> Rick Clunn       Score 46

LATE 80s

1> Rick Clunn       Score 41

2> Guido Hibdon Score 40

3> Larry Nixon      Score 35

Although Roland Martin literally dominated the 70s, no tourney pro dominated the 80s,

but I'd definitely give the nod to Larry Nixon (aggregate score: 99)

Roger

There are many ways to evaluate professional anglers. For example, you could base it on monetary earnings, total stringer weights,

prestigious awards like Angler of the Year and so on. I've devised my own pro ranking system, which is based on the following:

# of 1st place , # of 2nd place, # of 3rd place, # of Top-10 and # of Top-20.

Based on cumulative scoring, the top tourney pros during 80s decade would look something like this:

EARLY 80s

1> Larry Nixon       Score 64

2> Roland Martin Score 56

3> Rick Clunn       Score 46

LATE 80s

1> Rick Clunn       Score 41

2> Guido Hibdon Score 40

3> Larry Nixon      Score 35

Although Roland Martin literally dominated the 70s, no tourney pro dominated the 80s,

but I'd definitely give the nod to Larry Nixon (aggregate score: 99)

Roger

you have way to much time on your hands... lol just kiddin    

No this is what age teaches you, know what you are talking about and talk about what you know. Rolo was just backing up his take on it by using the facts from which  he drew his conclusion

Thank you Muddy

you have way to much time on your hands... lol just kiddin

I suppose I had that coming

While we're at it, this offers a rough draft of the 70s:

Late 70s

Top 10 Finishes

Roland Martin 16

Rick Clunn       12

Bill Dance       12

Early 70s

Top 10 Finishes

Roland Martin       30

Bill Dance       18

Ricky Green       13

(It's pretty safe to say that Roland Martin dominated the 1970s)

Roger