The Rooster

I don't expect the E to go down in price, as a matter of fact if I was to go with it then I'd just pay full price and forget it. I don't want to pay full price on a D though since I know it should now be discounted due to the E rolling out and making the D obsolete. The D looks like a great reel that is solid built, but just knowing that it should be less, or that I could have the "improved" version for the same money would keep me from buying it at full price, no matter how much I liked it. And I do like it. What's up with the new E having one less bearing than the D though?? Where are the bearings located in it?? That might be a question for Bantam1 instead.

I'm beginning to think I'd like a Shimano reel and the Citica is in my prefered price range of the low $100's. Question is, did they significantly improve the Citica this last time when they changed it?? Or not?? A Citica D at a bargain price of less than $100 would be nice and I'm waiting on the Wally Worlds around me to realize they are still stocking a dinosaur reel (well, the term dinosaur might be a bit strong) and put them on clearance. As it is they still sell for $119 But they'll probably not put them on clearance anytime soon, or if they do then it might not be more than $10 or so off. For that price, if the new E is better then I'd be better off going there instead. The D is bulky compared to the E, but that might not bother me so much. Basically, which one is better, or is there really a difference aside from looks and overall size??

No, not always. I know for a fact that the 5 bearing model I have does not have bearings in the crank paddles. They're all inside the body of the reel. All 5 of them. My question was about the 7 bearing versions, they too only have 5 bearings inside the body, making them identical to the earlier models UNLESS the extra 2 bearings are in the crank paddles. That's the only place left for the other 2 to be at. Otherwise there would be some false advertising going on. Noooooo. Bass Pro Shops wouldn't do that!!! (although if you do want to see something they probably didn't intend for you to see......take a close look at the 2009 Extreme advertisement in the catalog. Look closely at the model number printed on the side of the picture of the new Extreme with the swept handle. It's supposed to end with an E, but it's clearly a D instead, meaning it's a photograph of last year's model reel with this year's crank handle installed. No reason to do that, it would be harder to swap out handles for that pic than it would be to just use a new reel). Why they did that, I don't know, but they did. Doesn't mean anything though, I just thought it was interesting to note. I'm not saying they did false advertising though. It's just weird that that photo shows the D in the model number while it's supposed to be a pic of the new E models. BETTER YET!!! Go to the website and click on the pic of the reel to zoom in on it, look at the model number. It's clear as day that it's a D while having the E handle. Why did they do that?? Come to think of it, is it more weird that they did that or that I caught it?? I have a serious eye for details and miss hardly anything most of the time. But I also do know that some reels do have bearings in the cranks. I have a Pflueger spinning reel that is this way, it has 2 bearings in its crank handle. Sometimes companies put them there. One sure way to tell is to spin the paddles and watch to see how smoothly they spin and for how long. If they have bearings they'll spin smoothly and silently for several seconds before slowing down again. If not then they might make noises and only spin for a second or two and then stop.

All my reels are the ones that have the ITB braking, the inertia type that they did away with this year in favor of the "free spool" magnetic only. The only differences between any of my reels that I know are supposed to be there are that the newer ones all have 7 bearings while the older one I have only has 5. Sharkbite, I can see the paddles spinning more freely with the newer models than they do on the older one with less bearings so I suspect the other 2 bearings are inside those paddles. 1 in each one. However that's confusing to me cause for it to be totally effective, each paddle should have 2 instead of only 1. One bearing on each end of the axle inside the paddles. I've seen similar things done in spinning reels before, put one bearing on one side of the crank on the main gear and the other side just has a plastic supporting bushing only. Companies do that sort of thing at times and it always made no sense to me. I have a Shimano Sedona spinning reel that is that way. I would have used 2 bearings in that case but they didn't and I am thinking that the makers of the BPS baitcast reel (Pflueger) did that here as well. If that's what they did, well it's ok but I would have made it a 9 bearing reel instead, 2 per paddle instead of 1.

Here I am replying to my own question. : ;D Might as well cause I think I answered it for myself already. Ever since I got the newer versions I haven't fished the older one at all. Just now I went and looked at it and it seems that all the newer ones will let the crank paddles spin extra smoothly while the older one is a bit rough in the form of vibrations as the paddles turn. I'd still like confirmation of this but if that is the case then I won't mind cause that just means I can order a replacement handle to fit the newer ones and put it on the older one and have 5 reels all identical with 7 bearings each.

A few years ago Bass Pro Shops upgraded their Extreme baitcast reel from 5 bearings to 7. I had originally gotten one of the older 5 bearing models and still have it. But since then I have purchased 4 more of the newer 7 bearing models. Well tonight I took one of my newer ones apart for a routine clean and relubing and while inside I decided to see where the extra 2 bearings are now located. I expected them to be on the levelwind shaft actually cause that's about the only place left for them to be. The other 5 are located as follows.....1 ball bearing and 1 roller bearing on the cranking shaft, and 3 ball bearings on the spool shaft. Those 5 are all the original Extreme had but the newer one is supposed to have 2 more. However I could not find them anywhere inside at all. THEY'RE NOT THERE. I know cause I totally and completely disassembled my reel, levelwind shaft and all. There's only 5 bearings inside it. So are the other 2 in the handle crank?? If so I would have thought that should have had at least 4 (2 per paddle instead of only 1).

I also say that Bass Pro brand reels are great. Keep watching, usually this time of year for fall or around Christmas time you'll see the Extreme combo go on sale for $99. I've got 5 of the Extreme reels cause I think they are just awesome reels and are very affordable. I didn't care for the rod so much so I just got my own that I liked for them to go on, however if you need a budget combo, the Extreme is going to be very hard to beat. Now this next part is just my opinion and there's probably going to be some people who disagree, and that's fine too. This is just how I see it based on my experiences. I don't think there's any such thing as a baitcast reel for beginners. You can get a cheap one and learn to cast with it and then when you upgrade it's going to be like starting over again cause the better reels don't cast anything like the cheaper ones do. The spools are more free spinning and therefore can backlash much easier if you don't watch out. Use a cheap reel and get used to thumbing it the way it casts and then the better reel will spin a lot faster and you won't be ready. So I say just get as good as you can afford and learn to use it no matter it's difficulty level. I started out on a $45 Quantum with 2 bearings and it took a significant amount of weight in the lure to make it cast. I got used to it, then moved up to a Abu Garcia 5600C4 and basically had to relearn to cast again cause it was so much more free spooling. Then when I went to the Extreme I also had to teach myself to be better again. I say get a good one and if you aren't used to using it you can turn the cast control knob up a good bit tighter so it's less likely to backlash. That will cut down on distance of the cast but it will be less frustrating with all the backlashes you save yourself until you think you're ready to loosen it up some. And that way you don't have to go through two or three reels to learn them. You can put all that money into one good one right now. Again that's just my opinion. I just don't see paying $50 for a cheap one now and then when you later spend $100 or more on a better one it'll be like you never even knew how to cast. That was my experience anyway. Also, to me what makes a good one is.......for starters it MUST have an aluminum frame or some other metal. No graphite or plastic for the frame. I'm not sure why this is the case cause the spool should never even contact the frame, but I've seen it time and again with my reels and with friends who have them. A graphite framed reel will not cast nearly as easily or as far as a aluminum framed reel does. It's just a fact. Other than that, to judge the quality and see if it's right for you, you just have to look at them, spin the handle, feel the smoothness of the reel, press the button and watch the spool speed to see if it's a super free spool. See how it fits in your hand if it's comfortable or not. But if it doesn't have that aluminum frame.......well, as for me, I'd leave it in the store!

I don't want to hurt your feelings, however Shakespeare reels are widely known to be of not very good quality. I have a Shakespeare Excursion spinning reel here at home that proved that to me also. One day I went into Walmart and noticed they had these on clearance for $15. Original price had only been $20 but I figured why not, they looked decent so I got 2 of them. Within a week one of them begin making a popping noise as I cranked it so I returned it and just kept the one I had left. I fished it for a year and it was alright, but it begin making that same popping noise as the first one had done soon after. However my 90 day return period had already went out so I just kept it. Then the T handle started coming loose from the shaft. Then the reel REALLY started making more noises than just the popping, and finally the gears began grinding so bad it wasn't even pleasurable to use anymore. I liked the overall design of the reel, I just hated it's quality. Still I kept looking at them and eventually went through 3 more Shakespeares, 2 Tempest reels and one Intrepid. They all without exception had problems right out of the packages so I just returned them all and swore off Shakespeare. I still liked the design though so I noticed that Pflueger reels use the same basic design but costed a little more. I got two of those and they are of much higher quality build. After 1 1/2 years of owning them, they are solid and not coming apart to this minute. The Trion is exceptionally slick feeling. I also got one of the Presidents, a grade up over the Trion. Only problem I've had from the President reel was that for some reason I can't seem to find one that doesn't have a slight grind to the gears, though many people have them and love then and I see them recommended on here constantly. I've had 2 of them and they both did this. However the cheaper Trion ($40 vs. $60 for Prez) has never had these problems. I've had it now for 1 1/2 years and it's slick as glass. Best $40 I ever spent on a spinning reel. Aside from the slight grind in the Prez gears it was still a very solid reel, and the Trion is too. I figured the Prez might have had a bad batch or something, I just know I'll pay closer attention if I get anymore of them. Maybe I'm being too picky cause my brother in law sampled it and said it was smooth feeling to him, but to me it could be a good bit better. Still though, both reels are worlds better quality than the Shakespeares I had prior to this.

WOW those are great looking rods!!! After seeing those I'm ready to do mine!!! That would be a good idea to color code identical rods with various differences in reel gear ratios and or actions/powers. I'm having that trouble right now and up to this point I was considering colored tape on the shaft or a magic marker to tell the differences. Glad I waited on those ideas, your way would be much better.

You're getting all kinds of suggestions it seems. Since I was vague with my first post then I'll clarify some. Like some others said who also said Shimano, either the Compre or the Crucial would be good choices. I personally use the Compre as that is my first venture into owning better rods and I didn't want to go beyond $100 per stick. Having looked at the Crucial as well though, they seem to be worth every bit the other $50 that they cost over and above the Compre ($100 vs. $150). That is, as far as I'm able to tell in the store. I was basing my assumption on how light weight they felt and therefore how much more sensitive it might be as a result. I thought the Compre was one of the lightest rods I had ever held, and it is, but the Crucial was all that much better, I just couldn't afford to pay that out and still own 5 of them. Since I wanted them all to be the same I went with the Compre cause $500 beats $750.......and I'm on a budget! ;D You'll not go wrong with either one of these though. They really are great rods and with a lifetime warranty you don't have to worry about things going wrong and your investment going south. They wouldn't back them with that kind of warranty if they weren't worth the risk. You do have to pay $15 normally when something does fail though, to cover shipping the rod back, BUT you don't ship it back and wait on a new one, you just go to the store you purchased it from, give it to the dealer, pay $15 to cover his shipping costs, and walk out of the store with a brand new rod in hand. No waiting to get a new one, it's right now.

Shimano. Lifetime warranties on all their rods, from cheapest to most expensive. No matter if it's a line guide, handle, or rod itself.....it's covered. Prices from $40 to who knows where so something for everybody including the everyday fisherman.

Yup I saw custom salt rods in custom turned split wooden grips when I worked the tackle shop in San Diego in the 80's, they wound up on the half/full day boats... I should have stipulated in the bass rod industry they are really quite new... Tight Lines!!! Hey guys, I think even for bass rods they're even a bit older. In the mid 90's when I worked at Walmart they carried a Mitchell Fulcrum rod that had EVA foam split grips, it sold for around $39. Then they also had "their brand" of rod, the Renegade and it had EVA split grips as well. The Mitchell was advertised as being totally balanced, hense the name "Fulcrum" and I have to say it did feel noticeably lighter and absolutely zero balanced when you held the rod by gripping the reel. I think the very tip of the handle had a weight in it actually. They felt great in hand but all we had to compare them to were the other rods they sold at the time which were numerous and mostly cheap. We used to talk about how sensitive that balanced feel would help make the rod........though I never did buy one as I thought they were butt ugly at the time. A friend of mine did though and he fished it up until about 4 years ago when he finally snapped it one day while pulling against a5snagged lure. My mom actually got two of the spinning versions of the Renegade rods and she still has them. She doesn't fish at all anymore but she did briefly in the late 90's and those are what she used. Now I wish I had bought one of those Mitchell Fulcrums because the more I look at them the better they are looking to me. I'm on the band wagon per say about thinking they look sexy. They do! But that still doesn't change the fact that my Shimanos are my favorite rods and none of them have split grips, and even though I think they look cool, I can't see the slightest advantage to them.

One possible explaination could include that the rod sustained damage on the previous day's fishing trip, unnoticed by you, and then today with only the slightest force exerted on it, it was finished off (basically 3/4 of the way gone from the day before and then finished off the other 1/4 today). But rods don't just break when under no pressure at all. Something had to have happened somewhere, even if it wasn't your fault. I once sat a battery in my boat and realized just as I sat it down that it was going to hit one of my rods. I yanked it back up and thought I had missed the rod in just enough time. I then picked up the rod and examined it and it looked just fine too so I thought I had gotten lucky. But I'm a perfectionist so I started "micro-examining" it. Sure enough there was the tell tale small crack in the upper 6" of the rod and when I flexed it just a bit........SNAP!!! Tip broke right off. Now that example wasn't exactly like yours cause I know when and how it happened. But if I hadn't paid much attention to it cause I thought it was alright at first, then I might have forgotten about the battery, and days later when it broke I would have thought it "just happened". Sorry that happened to you though.

I guess it depends on the location of your stores and what mod setting they use. I used to work at Walmart for about 10 years. Not there now. Around here though, I have about 7 of those stores within less than an hour's driving time of me, and not one of them carry's the Pflueger President spinning reel. Just the Asaro baitcaster.

It's kind of pretty but it doesn't do anything for me, and I hate the handle. Sure does look solidly built though. Is there any plastic on or in it AT ALL??

I must be the only one who does it one finger behind and 3 in front. On casting I'm fairly accurate with overhead, side arm, and roll cast, but not at all on back hand. I need work there. Fortunately I have a HUGE back yard! Just wish there was a pond in it!! ;D I also only cast one handed. Baitcast or spinning, it's always one handed. I'm trying to make myself learn to use 2 hands at times, just so I can get more distance, though I really don't need it. 70 - 80 feet casts with ease are about all I have a need for. Ever see anyone cast a spinning rod with the reel flipped upside down (on top like a baitcaster)?? My brother does this. Starts out casting in the normal way by drawing back (but he crosses his body with this motion i.e. rod in right hand but pointing left), and instead of coming forward normally, he'll swing the tip of the rod overhead and when it comes down in front, the reel and rod are upside down and casting that way. And I know one more guy who REELS it that way!!! Cranking it backwards cause the reel is flipped over upside down!!! Weird.

How do you hold and cast a spinning rod?? I personally like to put my pinky finger of my casting hand behind the reel stem and make the cast. Then most of the time (but not all) I will move my finger in front of the reel stem so that all 4 fingers and thumb grip only the foregrip of the rod as I retrieve or fish the bait back to the boat. Therefore I constantly need a rod that has a foregrip. I'm sort of disturbed by the fact that I see a trend in doing away with this part of the rod, in favor of the smallest grip possible, some having nearly no grip at all. That might be better for sensitivity reasons, probably a lot more so actually, but having worked in the construction business for a number of years and having my hands wrapped around a hammer handle has made my hands so they hurt after a while of having a very closed in grip on something. The cork handles are large enough usually that that's not a problem, but having to grip only a rod shaft or else fish with the reel constantly between my fingers (hand moved back because of lack of a foregrip) would induce pain in my hands after a bit. They could do this to baitcast rods and I would be fine with it since I grip the reel as I fish so it provides a large enough grip for me. They could slap the reel straight to the shaft with duct tape (haha, kidding of course, I would want something a little better than that) and that would be OK. But spinning rods, it's a bad thing. I'm even hesitant to purchase my favorite brand of rods in a spinning model (Shimano) because of the trend they have of making what I feel are smaller than average cork foregrips, although I did notice the Crucial actually has a fairly bulky grip all things considered.

My brother in law uses all 7' rods and one 7'6" rod as well. He swears by them and wouldn't use anything else. I think he's got somewhere around 8 or more of these. I looked at them but I feel they're just too long no matter what advantages I get from them in terms of cast length and hook setting. I prefer 6'6" and prior to this I went through a phase of only wanting 6' rods. I still think a 6' is extremely comfortable to fish with but compared to my 6'6" rods they don't cast nearly as far. I can make the switch to 6'6" and still retain a great amount of comfort but the 7' length just feels like I'm going to hit stuff with it cause it's too long. Either that or the handle is in my way being so long.

I like a stiff rod for my spinnerbaits since I believe it helps me drive those heavy stiff hooks into the bony bass' mouth. But I've read from some people on here that they actually prefer as soft a rod as a crankbait rod for them. I guess it depends on how much tendency you have to swing for the fence when you set a hook. If you're that way then you might want a softer rod. If you can control it, or even set the hook half heartedly instead of really meaning it then you might want a stiffer rod to help. That's my take on it anyway and it's by no means an expert opinion. The one I personally use is a 6'6" medium heavy rod with a fast tip. The Shimano Compre CPC66MHB. I'd have probably went extra fast on the tip (the CPCX66MHB) but I wanted it to be able to throw a lot of different weights of spinnerbaits as well as jigs and T-rigs or maybe even an extra large jerkbait from time to time (I like my rods to multi task). I felt that the slightly slower tip would help it load better on lighter weight baits. That might be wrong but I had to start somewhere. It was either fast or extra fast and I thought the extra fast would narrow down its usable range (that is...the range that "I" operate in anyway) more than I would otherwise want.

If I were interested in upgrading the drag washers or bearings inside my reels, where can I buy such items?? Are they mostly readily available for any reel models, or only the most popular models??

You know me, I'd get a Shimano, particularly a Compre for $100 (6'6")or $110 (7').

I guess those reels were solid built. My brother in law has 7 of the Curado D's and he loves them. I'd like to have a couple of them but not at full price. They'd have to go on clearance for me to get interested.

I'm seeing there's a lot of Shimano Citica D's still around for sale in the local Walmart stores, several in my area have them. Also some tackle shops still do as well. Now that the new ones have been around for a whole year, are these old D's just basically a white elephant?? I can't see them selling unless someone just liked them so much they wanted more. They're still asking $119.99 for them!!!! Now if they were to go on clearance.........well then

Only other advice I can offer is if something doesn't immediately come apart, don't pry on it too hard, there may still be something else holding it on. Look around good and make sure there's not another screw or an E-clip or some other retaining device still holding it down. Also any springs inside will likely be under tension so when you remove them, try to hold something over them like a cup or piece of paper incase they fly out. That might help deflect it so when it does fly out it will land on the towel or nearby somewhere. I've had that happen to me so many times in reels where there's a spring, I'll pull it loose and it'll fly out and go acrossed the room landing in the carpet somewhere and I'll spend the next 45 minutes looking for it. A teeny tiny spring can drive you nuts if you lose it. I learned the hard way about that. In baitcasters there's sometimes a spring on the clutch mechanism, or on a flippin' switch. Had a Quantum reel one time that had a spring on the flippin' switch and I lost it for about an hour once and thought I'd never get to use the reel again cause I just about couldn't find it. Then I got lucky and there it was......15 feet away from where I'd lost it at. :

I think for me, I'll just use a graphite rod instead of a crankbait rod. I've held off a long time getting the rod for that reel because I could never fully decide one way or the other. But after catching that last fish and first missing it, then getting another chance at it again and that time nailing it, I see that the drag reducing trick works so I'm going to use it until I ever see that it won't for some reason and then I'll cross that bridge when the time comes.