I’ve went back and forth on this for years but lately I’ve developed more interest in building my own rods to satisfy my desires of what I think makes a good rod. This is mostly due to not being able to find very many spinning rods that have a grip that satisfies me, and when I do there’s availability issues, reel seat issues (think Fuji DPS seat flipped upside down with threads on top), hook keeper placement issues (can’t stand having it close to the handle) or sometimes price issues. And before anyone says it, concerning price, I know that making rods isn’t going to be cheap, but at least this way instead of spending $160 on a St. Croix Premier and having every rod in the rack always look identical, I would get exactly what I want in every one I make, right down to color choices, graphics, and custom matching the reels, and maybe even thread color changes to denote actions and powers to make it easy to tell one from another. I figure if I’m going to spend the money, it might as well be perfect in every sense of the word and offer options that I don’t get in branded and manufactured rods.

But, before attempting a complete build, I want to cut my teeth on a lesser project. I have an old rod here from the mid 90’s, a Quantum Dance Class 6’6” medium/fast rod. Some might remember them, they had blue colored IM-6 graphite blanks with Bill Dance’s signature on them and had full cork handles. Very similar to the current St. Croix Triumph rods in color and feel, but somewhat heavier overall. This rod is kind of heavy at 5-1/4 oz and it currently has a cracked line guide. I’ve posted about it before, about just replacing that guide only, but I never did try it. It’s leaned in the corner for over 10 years now, just waiting.

Now, instead of replacing that guide, I think I’d rather just strip all the guides off of it and go back with something completely different, as a starter project. I’ve studied up on guide placement and theory, and I understand that this rod currently has the old Cone of Flight design. It has a large 25mm stripper guide and has a total of 7 guides that get progressively smaller all the way out to the tip top. They don’t all line up either, due to placement and size differences, so it’s not even a smooth cone transition. If I’m going to replace all the guides I would rather put guides on that fit either the Fuji New Concept placement, or maybe even the KR Concept placement. Only thing that might make me choose one over the other would be how difficult it might be to remove the current tip top. I don’t want to damage the blank trying to twist that off. The New Concept system might allow me to just use a standard guide, not the KR style, and match the current tip top. I’m imagining that they make some standard guides that are lighter weight than these large guides it has now. I also don’t think it needs a big 25mm stripper guide. Something smaller diameter should do fine. I’ll use this rod with 8-10 pound mono line at the most, or maybe braid, though if I use braid then the KR guides would be better.

For this project, my goals are:

1. Make a useable rod from one that currently isn’t useable.

2. Learn how to place and wrap guides and finish them.

3. Possibly gain a lighter and better performing rod than I had before, and one that will balance with a lighter reel, something in the 7 to 7.5 oz range instead of the current 8.6 oz reel it takes to balance it now.

4. I’ll consider a complete handle replacement too if there is a way to remove that. The current handle is fine, but it feels bulky in diameter. Something thinner and more streamlined might be nicer.

I’ve watched a lot of videos online where people have removed guides and they managed to clean the blank up so well that the old guide placement wasn’t even visible anymore. I am assuming that the Cone of Flight guide placement might not work with the New Concept spacing since that concept involves using more and smaller guides placed closer together. So cleaning up the blank is going to be necessary since the guides would be in new locations.

One final thing. I plan to build my own rod making station. I’ll buy the rotating and drying motor since those are already cheaper than I could build one for, but I’m an accomplished woodworker so building the other needed supports and thread wrapping devices won’t be a problem for me, and I already have some of the materials here that I’d need for that anyway. I also think that will make this whole thing even more enjoyable rather than just buying a thread wrapping station.

I guess the point of this post is to ask if there’s any advice you could offer or maybe point out anything I haven’t thought of yet? I will post pics here to show progress and the complete project once finished.

Awesome. I've been doing this for more than 40 years. I first started working on commercially available stock rods and moved into custom rod building. Even invented my own spiral wrap guide design as published in rodmaker magazine in 2020.

Concerning the guides, today I use a 3 step down guide funnel. And the stripper guide is now less than the size of a quarter while B.A.S.S. founder Ray Scott recommends using a dime size to start with and reduce from there.

https://www.rayscott.net/news/cr/rodandreel.html

"Scott's downsizing theory is revolutionary as far as typical spinning rod size guides. Starting with the "dime-size" gathering guide 18-inches in front of the cork handle, the guide placement is increasingly smaller toward a tiptop with a "pinpoint size opening."

"Conventional spinning rods feature an oversize stripper guide and normal size guide placement," points out Scott. "With smaller size stripper guide and reducing the overall guide sizes, there's less line drag and slap on the cast and improves casting distance and accuracy," he claims."

Depending on the size or load considerations I vary the rest of the guides from micro guides on medium light and medium rods and some MH rods, but may go a little larger on stiffer MH rods. I prefer the look and performance of tighter line management along the blank.

As for grips, this is also something I have experimented with and in middle of doing one now for my 12 year old son.

Years ago I came across the Bass Pro "power hump" grip. It was a game changer for me. So I began tinkering with my own version of it trying different shapes over the years.

On one of my favorite baitcasting rods I did careful testing of the shape of the grip to fit my hand better, and I even turned it on the blank offset from top dead center about 3 degrees to the right.

Most people who construct shaped grips will invariably align them to top dead center, but this is a general catch all position and may not truly be a best fit for you and how you hold a rod, so as you get into customizing them, play around with it, and don't be afraid to experiment.

Like you said you are a woodworker, so shaping cork will be super easy for you. Once you get the shape or shapes you like, put them on the rods and experiment the positioning to make sure it fits you best before gluing them in place.

One last thing about rods... and there is a lot of debate over this, but I am 100% in the spining a rod camp. This is proven science by aerospace engineers that Gary Loomis hired decades ago. Most fishing rods, golf clubs, and even arrow shafts for bows and arrows all exhibit a weaker spine spot that is caused from how the pre-peg flags are rolled into the blanks. There is almost always a thinner wall side to them. And it is this slightly thinner wall area of the blanks that produces a weakest degree spot on the blank out of 360 degrees in the cast load zone of a blank. I seek that spine degree because it belongs placed in one certain location for performance custom rod building as described by god of the rods himself Gary Loomis:

What Gary Loomis says here in this short video in my opinion is 100% correct and accurate, and this is how I also spine my rods as well.

I recently acquired a custom rod made by someone else who did not spine it correctly and right now that blank is standing in the corner completely stripped down back to the blank with my goal of if I am going to use this rod from now on it will be spined correctly. It was nearly 90 degrees off to the right and I could not live with it in that condition. So off with the reel seat and all the useless pretty thread wrapping and gobs of epoxy they used. All removed now back to the original Loomis blank for rebuilding it the Gary Loomis way, and as a minimalist with all efforts geared 100% towards performance and zero art additions and no unnecessary thread wraps on any guides that are off the guide foot and on rod only. That is not allowed in my world. Threads wraps on rods are only for holding guides and hook keepers in place and nothing else. No art wraps period. Just how I developed over the years as a custom rod builder. Strictly performance geared and no art.

Today there is another theory dividing custom rod building called straightest axis theory. Buy a rod blank. Roll it around on a flat surface and just pick the straightest axis and build a rod on that. No science to it really. No consideration for blank structural factors. Straightest axis theory to me is not science and not in alignment with performance rod building. But this is just my point of view from decades of learning and researching it myself and concluding my own conclusions based on available information. I side 100% with Gary Loomis and his aerospace engineers on this one.

Also be aware MudHole, Get Bit Outdoors, and Dr. Matthew Cashion and many others also subscribe to spining rod blanks for construction alignment and you can find their videos on youtube saying so. So keep this in mind as you move forward as to what you prefer- a spine aligned collection of rods, or rods all over the place based on whether one thinks its straightest or not.

To this day spining a rod blank is still the standard of performance.

The rods work fine either way, but some of us think and believe spine aligning takes performance up a notch or two as Gary Loomis describes in the video above. All your choice though. I just wanted to give both sides to this issue.

This is one of my recent baitcasting rod grips with modified power hump type of grip turned upside down from original shaping, and offset from top dead center about 3 degrees for the most perfect fit I could come up with. This rod fits like a glove now. Made from cork from different sources, there is actually more of a hump to the bottom of the rod than to the top side. It just seemed to feel better, give me a better grip, and was just more comfortable upside down from how I first intended it to be.

Custom rod building is truly custom, so make it fit you and go for it.

2 hours ago, The Rooster said:

For this project, my goals are:

1. Make a useable rod from one that currently isn’t useable.

2. Learn how to place and wrap guides and finish them.

3. Possibly gain a lighter and better performing rod than I had before, and one that will balance with a lighter reel, something in the 7 to 7.5 oz range instead of the current 8.6 oz reel it takes to balance it now.

4. I’ll consider a complete handle replacement too if there is a way to remove that. The current handle is fine, but it feels bulky in diameter. Something thinner and more streamlined might be nicer.

A couple of comments about your goals:

#2: Measure using the metric system...I know, I know..."Its not American." Well, "Au contraire!"

Fuji (Anglers Resource) and MudHole...etc...etc all have guide placement systems. They all overlook that fact that the first guide from the handle (aka Stripper, Butt guide) needs to be a certain distance. I like to start with 51cm (close to 20"). They have also, all published mistakes. So measure twice, wrap once.

Another tip about guides: Buy the guide kits. I can't tell you how much time I've wasted hunting down the rights size, color, quantity.

#3: Try not to worry so much about balance. Holding a reel in your hand does very little to reduce weight forward or backwards. Today blanks are also WAY lighter than the ones of yesteryear. If you make your rod as light as you can...then you've done all you can do.

#4: "it feels bulky in diameter". If its cork...then just sand it down.

After I made this post I thought about the handle. It is a cork handle. I can sand it down and shape it so that’s what I’ll do.

I can also measure in metric as long as I have a list of measurements to go by. How do I plan for specific guide locations other than the first guide being 51cm from the reel spool?

As for rod balance, this is definitely a blank from yesteryear so some of the weight I feel might be in the blank itself. It’s about 30 years old now. But if I can’t balance it for use the way I want to then I have no use for it. For spinning rods I hold all of them by the foregrip in front of the reel. This is the point where all spinning rods balance and I find that it reduces stress and fatigue when fishing for long periods. Weight is still a factor but at least I’m not also fighting a tendency for a tip heavy rod to point downward when I need it upwards, stuff like that. I’ve seen some people hold their spinning rods right over the reel, with the reel stem centered between middle and ring fingers, or sometimes with one pinky behind it, and even worse, only one index finger in front of it. That last one makes for a tip heavy feeling no matter what. So I do have to think about balance for those reasons. If I can get a light set of guides to remove some weight out front then I can also use a lighter reel in behind, and theoretically maintain balance while also reducing weight.

Tearing down and rebuilding existing rods is one option. But I don’t recommend it for a first timer. Yes, you can usually get the blank pretty clean but some of the factory epoxies are a real pain. You’ll probably have to wrap the guides a little longer than strictly necessary to cover scratches from removing the old epoxy. And then you have the risk of residue that you can’t quite see.

I would instead recommend that for your first build you start from a fresh blank. You can learn the basics of building a rod without the complications of stripping one down in the first place. There is a learning curve so don’t make it steeper by adding trouble you can avoid. Also, you sound like you’re pretty specific in knowing what you want. The rod you have now is heavy, you don’t like the grip, and the guides aren’t in the right place. Why put any more time into that setup to marginally improve it? Just get the thing that works for you. Even if you don’t do the best job with the wraps or epoxy, you’ll still have something designed just how you want with a better blank and components than what you have.

First guide at 19-20 inches is fine. The reason smaller reduction guides work is that they are higher, so don't just go with normal low but small guides. The Fuji KR software works fine for reduction guide size and placement-I use 20KLH-10KLH-5.5M with runners that vary depending on what the rod is being made for. That's good for braid up to about 20 pound test. Mostly I use 4-4.5mm runners, but if you don't want to worry about knots going smoothly through with a double uni then consider 5 or 5.5's. I don't EVER buy guide kits because I know what I want and it's never in a kit. 3 reduction guides, 2 KB's, and 4 KT's for a rod like yours. KB/KT's all the same size.

If you get into selling rods make sure you understand the excise tax rules-see the library in Rodbuilding.org

The KLH height guides are nothing new, that height guide was used in Europe since around the time of WW II, G Loomis has used them since at least the time off the business starting to build rods, my IM6 rods had them, and I bet the older LCI rods may also have used them. They were called "match" guides and came both with double and single feet. The issue is not so much ring diameter as ring height off the blank for best performance, we're talking 5% or less when we are talking about this though. The real advantage is balance and weight out on the tip of the rod; this can be cut dramatically. You very well may be able to use the existing guides you have to get a decent reduction path and just buy some small fly frame guides to finish, saving a bunch of money. The original Concept framed guides are not near the height of the Fuji KLH and similar guides, about half the distance between yours and the KLH guides, wouldn't hurt to try. A 20 mm concept is about the same height as your 25 mm.

On 1/25/2026 at 5:41 PM, The Rooster said:

...

For spinning rods I hold all of them by the foregrip in front of the reel. This is the point where all spinning rods balance and I find that it reduces stress and fatigue when fishing for long periods. Weight is still a factor....

OK...I see Brian Latimer do this and also has a line of rods with a longer foregrip.

There are a few techniques that would be good for a tip heavy rod...but that's another discussion all together.

Rod built to Rooster's specs, it's a Rogue dropshot rod design, of old Skamania or Michigan salmon/steelhead rods. A long Tennessee grip also allows you the versatility to move your reel with no restrictions.

spencer- I'm also in the tennessee seat camp for rods where you have a balance question and want some flexiblity on the reel position. Centerpin rods for sure are one of those for me.

If I recall correctly, a lot of earlier float rods (spin and centerpin) used a 3-5" rear butt and a half wells fly rod grip in the front. I have an older browning that was set up that way. I didn't like that confirguration because a half wells pushes your hand too far forward to touch the reel, even with a pinkie on a 5" centerpin reel.

Got to jump in here. My Dad built rods professionally in the 1950's and 60's. As his eyes got bad, I wrapped a lot for him. I continued in the 1970's selling a few custom made rods and did some of my own. I haven't built a rod this century. No need to. Commercially built rods are just too good. I value my time extremely. I need $150/hr to talk. I can buy a rod at a reasonable price that is at least as good as I can build. Now it won't be custom for me, have pretty wraps, etc., but will catch fish as well as anything I can build. I still do my own repairs and help a few friends, but my eyes are gone. I like "E" thread.

More power to you if you like the custom stuff, but even at my age (79 going on 80), I'm still a tournament fisherman. If it don't help me put fish in the boat, I don't need it. Spare me all your rationalization. Not buying it.

12 hours ago, mcipinkie said:

...I can buy a rod at a reasonable price that is at least as good as I can build.

Yup...you certainly can...but up to a point.

I would contend that you can build yourself a rod that would be better (and way less expensive) than any rod you could buy commercially.

I'm 85, been building since high school off and on, still am. I just build for family, friends, and me. I cannot buy rods that have the dimensions, the grip shapes and sizes, or in most cases, the guide characteristics that I prefer. One thing for sure is that I cannot get the cork quality I like on commercial rods at any price. I know when I build that I have the seat and guide orientation relative to the blank characteristics (spine/Flat Line Oscillation) what I want also. Whether they catch more fish or not is certainly debatable, but the pleasure I get fishing them is not.

I caution anyone thinking that they will make a lot of money building-you'd better be able to build a lot faster than I can if you want to make money. I could probably do better greeting at Walmart than I could selling. You also better have a good, well-communicated policy on warranty because I guarantee-you will have broken rods brought back to you. And the story will most likely be "I was just casting and it broke."

It’s incredibly addictive and fun. I’ve enjoyed it for over 20 years. If you are in Northeast GA I’m happy to help show anyone how to get started.

Hi Steven, Alex here. Having health problems and had to quit fishing last year but hopefully not this year. You were a good guide last year thanks.

I use to build all my saltwater rods. But changes in my life and a move, I had to give it up. There is nothing like landing your PB on a rod that you built. I haven't built a rod in over 25 years. The new equipment to build rods is amazing. All my rod making stands, drying stands etc were homemade.

This year I built the lightest jerkbait rod MHX CB841 with 3-4 inches off the butt. A week ago it broke on a cast...not a clean break either. Im guessing I nicked it on the boat jerking. I was gonna send it back as warrenty and hated the thought of cutting it up. I had made a carbon handle for it that was sweet. So I decided to try and repair it with internal and external stints (from an old Lews Speed Stick). It worked out pretty well. I never considered keeping the rod straight when making these kinds of repair....cause it now has a small bend. I took it out yesterday and caught a couple fish on it.