No.

Thus my point is made. Someone's results or opinions are different than 'yours' so defensiveness takes over to the point of nausea.

It's not defensive at all. I just want more results are data and I think it's great... But it's incomplete. I want FC to stretch lol, why would I get defensive about it stretching?

I really don't mean to argue. OP definitely has his heart in the right place and I like where he's going. It does make me wish I could make an episode of mythbusters around fishing line gimmicks and performance though.

Thanks for your hard work and confirming to me that there is nothing new under the sun except the gimmicks they try to fool anglers with!

If we go back to your original post in this thread you clearly imply that those of us who use fluorocarbon are simply fooled by the tackle manufacturers marketing. Also implied is your superiority in discerning such foolishness. Your criticism of others for relying on their own opinion seems a little hypocritical to me.

For the record I don't care what line anyone uses other than the people whose opinions I trust. This is a discussion forum though. Why is it we can't discuss these things without pettiness?

Amen. This is nothing but a discussion. The man did his homework, performed unbiased tests, and shared his results. Only negative response I have is he should have used 10lb. I digress...We don't need petty responses. Yes, they are your opinions, but please keep it civil. You want debates, go to Facebook.

Welcome aboard TommyV. You don't mind jumping into the deep end do you?! Some of us, including me, get a little snarky at times but this is the best, most well mannered fishing site on the interweb. Enjoy.

I enjoy catching fish, so naturally I wanted fluorocarbon to be everything it was cracked up to be (still got a drawer full of the stuff).

Over time however, I had to loosen my grip on whimsy, and tighten my grip on reality (there go my delusions of grandeur).

 

> Fluorocarbon is 'twice' the diameter of braid, but is not 'twice' as abrasion-resistant as braid.

> Fluoro is dense, but trollers & deep-sea fishermen usually achieve greater depth with 'finer line diameter' not "denser line"

> Fluoro fractures easily and thus has poor knot strength. The last 2 knot failures I had in many years was braid juxta fluoro

> I admit to being spoiled by braided polyethylene, and no longer have the tolerance to fish with an elastic band.

     I've actually caught myself taking a step backward while setting the hook with Seaguar Tatsu fluoro (to absorb the elasticity).

 

Roger

A few questions.

1. What knot did you use?

2. Why test stretch at line strength without using 75%* of line strength? 8 lb @ 6 lb load?

3. Did you measure the line? What with?

* it's impossible to apply 8 lbs load with tackle used to fish 8 lb line, 6 lbs is high enough to yield 8 lb line.

The lines should be grouped by diameter, 8 lbs label line with .009-.0095 only. Any line larger diamter like Yo-Zuri @ .011-.0115 should be at 12 lb test or 75% = 9 lb load.....apples. To apples. Yo-Zuri 4 lb test is .009, use that in your 8 lb category for example. Sunline and others 12 lb line is .011-.0115, use those to compare line in the .011 diamter class.

Your stretch test shows how honest line mfr's are, good post!

Tom

ame="0119" post="1715372" timestamp="1425328442"]

It's not defensive at all. I just want more results are data and I think it's great... But it's incomplete. .

So like I said, you could perform your own tests instead of finding fault in the work of someone else who's purpose was accomplished.

Welcome aboard TommyV. You don't mind jumping into the deep end do you?! Some of us, including me, get a little snarky at times but this is the best, most well mannered fishing site on the interweb. Enjoy.

He hasn't learned. And I'm proud to be a member. Less than 24 hours and I'm amazed at the wealth of knowledge being displayed.

What I think this chart helps me with is it gives me a better idea of which fluorocarbon lines stretch the most. So in an application that you prefer mono for it's stretch you can get  a line with high amount of stretch but also that sensitivity that fluoro is highly regarded for. Best of both worlds

So like I said, you could perform your own tests instead of finding fault in the work of someone else who's purpose was accomplished.

Well at least now I have my first project for when I retire! Only about 30ish years to go haha

A few questions.

1. What knot did you use?

2. Why test stretch at line strength without using 75%* of line strength? 8 lb @ 6 lb load?

3. Did you measure the line? What with?

* it's impossible to apply 8 lbs load with tackle used to fish 8 lb line, 6 lbs is high enough to yield 8 lb line.

The lines should be grouped by diameter, 8 lbs label line with .009-.0095 only. Any line larger diamter like Yo-Zuri @ .011-.0115 should be at 12 lb test or 75% = 9 lb load.....apples. To apples. Yo-Zuri 4 lb test is .009, use that in your 8 lb category for example. Sunline and others 12 lb line is .011-.0115, use those to compare line in the .011 diamter class.

Your stretch test shows how honest line mfr's are, good post!

Tom

Good point. I found that out years  ago with flyfishing leaders. I carry a micrometer in the boat now. Pretty geeky eh?

Slack line,,,i can see my line move before i feel it then again im a line watcher sorta like 'you know its cold outside when you go out side and its cold' i know that myself before the weatherman tells me

 

If there was one line that stood out to me in this entire test though it was the P-Line CX Premium Co-Polymer.  Not only was it low stretch, but it was much less in diameter than Yozuri Hybrid and Trilene XT (they are about .011) and CX is .009 (feels even thinner).  I am looking forward to trying it out this year because I think it may offer at least some of the sensitivity of fluorocarbon.  

 

  

 

 

I'm a big P-Line fan so I've been fishing CX on spinning gear for years. I've tried to tell people how good this line is but most guys simply won't try it because it isn't the "latest/greatest". About the only P-Line product that I've not liked is Fluoroclear. It has a ton of stretch and poor knot strength, or at least in my experience it's performed this way. 

"

A few questions.

1. What knot did you use?

2. Why test stretch at line strength without using 75%* of line strength? 8 lb @ 6 lb load?

3. Did you measure the line? What with?

* it's impossible to apply 8 lbs load with tackle used to fish 8 lb line, 6 lbs is high enough to yield 8 lb line.

The lines should be grouped by diameter, 8 lbs label line with .009-.0095 only. Any line larger diamter like Yo-Zuri @ .011-.0115 should be at 12 lb test or 75% = 9 lb load.....apples. To apples. Yo-Zuri 4 lb test is .009, use that in your 8 lb category for example. Sunline and others 12 lb line is .011-.0115, use those to compare line in the .011 diamter class.

Your stretch test shows how honest line mfr's are, good post!

Tom "

Tom, I'll try to answer most of your questions best I can:

1) I used a double Palomar knot. Where lines broke, it was up the line above the weight...the knots held.

2) I think there are a number of ways to do this test and I may do more. The reason I picked an 8 pound weight was to use the maximum so as to accentuate the difference between the various lines. Although a lesser weight might be closer to the real world, some of the results might be closer together and harder to see differences. We're all looking for subtle differences in the products we choose, and I wanted to try to make those differences as obvious as possible. If I get time, I may do another round of tests at 4 pounds on a cross section of these lines.

3) I measured the lines with - what else would a fisherman use - a Hawg trough... Ha! Of course I'm Kidding, I used a tape measured and tried to get down to 1/8 inch.

4) Yes, I do think that line diameter can make a difference in stretch - that's why I did the second breakout with just those that were .009 inches in diameter and throw out the Yo-Zuri's and XT's that were thicker. There were 9 lines (half of the lines tested) that fit the .009 criteria. But in terms of the 3 different line categories, fluorocarbon still stretched the most. P-line CX co-polymer and several of the fluorocarbons were the same diameter but CX stretched less - and maybe most importantly, didn't break.

Good stuff frydog62 - I've done a ton of line testing on my own also, so I can appreciate the effort and interest. Lots of ways to dissect the data and run the tests, all of which will give different results, but will also help answer one small part of the puzzle.

 

Another interesting test you might try, beside the 1/2 rated test (I've run it before and you should see some slight differences there), is to soak all lines in water for about 1 hour before testing to better simulate "field" conditions. This is important because nylon lines absorb water, and some tests show changes to stretch increase by as much as 20% or more (vs. dry) depending upon exact test. Theoretically, all 100% fluorocarbons shouldn't absorb water, and therefore, you shouldn't see any change in stretch between samples tested "dry" vs. samples tested "wet." My guess is that if you did this, you'd see a difference in results, with many of the monos and copolys stretching more than your original set of data, quite possibly more than the fluoros at that point.

 

Additionally, there is a pretty strong inverse correlation between line diameter and stretch, so the closer you can keep the lines paired and tested in that regard, the better the quality of your data.

 

-T9

Interesting test, thanks for posting!

I have been having line debates for years especially when I worked in a tackle shop spooling line, and I can say with 100% confidence that Fluorine (which is fluorocarbon monofilament) stretches the most by far which your findings illustrated. The low stretch came as a gimmick early on when the lines were so stiff that you couldn't use it for main line like companies wanted so badly since braid improvements in last 15-20 years is amazing and companies realized that people would pay $15, and be good for 2 years and now they are not selling enough line..IN comes all the fancy copolys and Fluoros (Notice the Saltwater scene or magazines till this day are not pushing fluoro main lines, those guys use heavy Mono leader which is expensive so no need to push fluoro main line and then have issues of breakage and learning time with it, guys who fish saltwater heavy use fluoro for leader for abrasion resistance, other than that I don't think they care about clarity etc.

 

I use fluoro because I think it helps soft baits sink more naturally, is more stealth, thinner generally if good quality, but needs to be taken care of. I used to hate it but in the last few years, last 2 years it has gotten much better but it is a good shock absorber for braid, Mono is actually worse but nylon and copolys float since they really don't put much fluorine in copolys, it is about marketing money...Just watch Diameter, Breaking strength, and don't assume expensive line is better, only 3 factories if not 2 make pure fluorocarbon. The easier it casts the abrasion factor is less, but that is what leader is for, fluoro leader is stiffer than regular fluoro, that is something I would like to see tested, I can feel my baits better with fluoro to braid than Nylon mono to braid but maybe it's in my head?

 

Also, I used to like line conditioner for memory, but fluoro is waterproof and sunproof and bullet proof, so a guy from Lockheed martin who is a smart guy with all this stuff told me that it only works because I want it too, and sun tan lotion would do the same as line conditioner, it is only good for your reel and for seeling Nylon if you believe it does that. I can't find a reason to put in on Fluoro because the memory is reduced by pulling the line while applying it but that is deforming it and stretching it which reduces memory since we all know how easy fluoro is to handle on spinning gear...But I like it as a leader and main line, I am careful, tie often, and you kind of do get what you pay for...Seaguar and Japanese companies seem to be ahead in the fluorine market, Hybrid is great if you want clear or green wire, 6lb is 12.8 lb test but makes a heck of a flipping line, not ultra soft though.....

On 3/1/2015 at 8:06 PM, Montanaro said:

Shooter tested as low stretch by TT. That and abrasion resistance makes it good for pitching.

I may have to revisit copoly though, just doubt it can top shooter for what I use it for.

Did we add shooter to the list? Was it tested? 

Anyway possible you could test Sufix Advance Mono ? I'd really like to see how it compares under your test. I know it has the least stretch of any non braid I've used.

I just tested 12 feet of Sufix advance mono with a scale. Pulled to 8lbs and it stretched 9.25 inches . at 9.6 lbs it broke at knot before I could measure it.

2 minutes ago, dodgeguy said:

I just tested 12 feet of Sufix advance mono with a scale. Pulled to 8lbs and it stretched 9.25 inches . at 9.6 lbs it broke at knot before I could measure it.

What pound test were you working with?

8