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OkobojiEagle

weight of lead baits

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It's pretty dam* cold outside this morning so I decided to throw out this question.  Do you choose lead jig head weight by the lightest you can feel when being fished or the heaviest you can fish to speed up your presentation?  I've long been in the first camp, first being introduced to the concept by Charlie Brewer's slider techniques.  Most weights I carry run 1/8oz - 3/8oz... most used 1/8, 3/16 & 1/4.  Moving spinnerbaits are 3/8 & 1/2oz because I fish them fast.  I don't often fish deeper than 20 feet. Curious to read where you put yourself.

 

oe

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I try to fish the lightest jig possible. Hoping that the heavier weight doesn't impart un-natural action. 

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Yes :lol:

 

While I was fishing tourneys (for over 25 years), it was always the latter because of efficiency. Since I stopped about a decade ago, it now much more resembles the former. 

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I have an uncle who always use  the lightest weight possible because that is what Bill Dance said to do . I go the other route and used heavier weights . I out-fish him badly .  

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Well it depends......... If the current is raging I use a heavy one. If it's slack I use a light one. If the water is muddy I use a heavy one . If it's clear I might use light one or go weightless. Certainly don't hem yourself into only going one way or the other 

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4 hours ago, OkobojiEagle said:

It's pretty dam* cold outside this morning so I decided to throw out this question.  Do you choose lead jig head weight by the lightest you can feel when being fished or the heaviest you can fish to speed up your presentation?  I've long been in the first camp, first being introduced to the concept by Charlie Brewer's slider techniques.  Most weights I carry run 1/8oz - 3/8oz... most used 1/8, 3/16 & 1/4.  Moving spinnerbaits are 3/8 & 1/2oz because I fish them fast.  I don't often fish deeper than 20 feet. Curious to read where you put yourself.

 

oe

I guess I'm a bit confused by the question... I've been known to do both. And... at the same time. :) Maybe I am missing something in the question? (My wife tells me that far too often :rolleyes:).

 

My go at it:

 

The issue starts with the water... a viscous gelatinous medium. Fundamentally, weight is the first line of offense, coupled with line diameter, in terms of basic depth and speed control. And... I think that pretty much covers both alternatives?:

4 hours ago, OkobojiEagle said:

lightest you can feel ... or the heaviest you can fish to speed up..

 

In terms of sensitivity, I'm not much worried about weight, beyond that any weight must be matched to an appropriate line diameter; The two are inseparable. "Approriate" means... to fishing conditions as well as weight, and hook. I think... this pretty much takes care of sensitivity, depth, and speed? Bang, bang, bang?

 

From here, cover and visibility conditions (to the fish), weighs in. I start my tackle choices for a given outing with the size outfit that will fit the particular conditions and circumstances. @J Francho was the first I heard articulate this, and I realized that this is my starting point too.

 

Many of my waters are shallow and weedy. So, I either need jigs that will swim over the tops of the weeds, or root down into the base of them. Weight is determined by the job, then I choose the proper outfit, and proper line (I have xtra spools, or designated reels).

 

Some exceptions:  

-Wind might have me going up in weight, and/or down in line diameter, or to FC for its density -an advantage above the water, at the surface film, as well as below. 

 

-Water density changes due to temperature: As a serious subsurface (nymph) fly-fisherman in moving water, I came to appreciate this effect enormously. It's less noticeable with conventional tackle bc of the sheer amount of weight we're talking -even a 1/16oz jig would be getting unwieldy on trout-sized fly tackle. But it is one of the reasons I go to L and UL tackle in winter here.

 

-I may go extra heavy to feel bottom substrate.

 

Is this anywhere close to your question?

 

3 hours ago, TnRiver46 said:

Well it depends......... If the current is raging I use a heavy one. If it's slack I use a light one. If the water is muddy I use a heavy one . If it's clear I might use light one or go weightless. Certainly don't hem yourself into only going one way or the other 

Ah! A river man! Nothing like current to show you that there is a real world out there. :thumbsup: 

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"As light as I can get away with" is my general method for finesse presentations like shakeyheads and similar.  Slow or drift-like movement is natural and/or neutral which what you're trying to accomplish with finesse-y type stuff usually...So the lighter the better if that's the goal.  Some exceptions, but that's sort of my default.  Everything else is variable based on conditions and what I'm doing. 

 

Moving baits like spinnerbaits, chatterbaits, swimjigs are all dependent on the depth and speed I'm looking for.  On a spinnerbait, blade size can effect the lift and how easily it rolls, so that is also a factor in the weight I want sometimes.

 

Jigs are all over the place...A football jig I usually want planted on the bottom so the weights are heavier than you might otherwise expect.  A casting jig could be light or very heavy depending on if I want it drift down slowly to entice a fish or if I want it to smash a fish on the head to get it eating out of pure reaction...Usually one of these methods works when the other doesn't ;).  You can up the weight on skipping jigs to give you more momentum, might result in a couple extra feet under the dock if you do your part right...Can also go lighter while skipping if the water is shallow so it's not always pinned to the bottom or if the fish are right up on the surface underneath a dock.    

 

Flipping wise, if there's heavy cover I need to get through obviously I'll use heavier weights.  Sometimes though, there's heavy cover I want to stay out of while flipping....Like a lake with a bottom covered in decades of wood debris, you want to flip the laydown or stump or whatever but stay out of the trash on the very bottom.  I'll flip pretty light weights in those situations.  

 

Then for all baits there is the wind and/or current factor...May need to go heavier to compensate.  

 

So the answer is, all of the above.  

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I generally start at 1/2 oz. and work up from there, with jigs.  If I want to go lighter, it's a different bait, like a wacky jig or shaky head worm.  Same with spinnerbaits, it's almost always a 1/2 oz. bait.  Just like @Logan S mentioned, various blades carry the bait differently.  I have a couple 3/4 oz. spinnerbaits, in case I feel like I want more speed, but maintain depth.  As @Paul Roberts mentioned, I'm always choosing what setups I bring on a kayak trip based on where I'm fishing.  I keep it to six or less, and pick setups that match the cover and presentations I'll likely want to fish.  That could mean 4 drop shot rods, and a football jig rod, or six completely different combos.  Living in western NY affords me some really diverse waters to fish.

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1 hour ago, Paul Roberts said:

I guess I'm a bit confused by the question... I've been known to do both. And... at the same time. :) Maybe I am missing something in the question? (My wife tells me that far too often :rolleyes:).

 

My go at it:

 

The issue starts with the water... a viscous gelatinous medium. Fundamentally, weight is the first line of offense, coupled with line diameter, in terms of basic depth and speed control. And... I think that pretty much covers both alternatives?:

 

In terms of sensitivity, I'm not much worried about weight, beyond that any weight must be matched to an appropriate line diameter; The two are inseparable. "Approriate" means... to fishing conditions as well as weight, and hook. I think... this pretty much takes care of sensitivity, depth, and speed? Bang, bang, bang?

 

From here, cover and visibility conditions (to the fish), weighs in. I start my tackle choices for a given outing with the size outfit that will fit the particular conditions and circumstances. @J Francho was the first I heard articulate this, and I realized, that this is my starting point too.

 

Many of my waters are shallow and weedy. So, I either need jigs that will swim over the tops of the weeds, or root down into the base of them. Weight is determined by the job, then I choose the proper outfit, and proper line (I have xtra spools, or designated reels).

 

Some exceptions:  

-Wind might have me going up in weight, and/or down in line diameter, or to FC for its density -an advantage above the water, at the surface film, as well as below. 

 

-Water density changes due to temperature: As a serious subsurface (nymph) fly-fisherman in moving water, I came to appreciate this effect enormously. It's less noticeable with conventional tackle bc of the sheer amount of weight we're talking -even a 1/16oz jig would be getting unwieldy on trout-sized fly tackle. But it is one of the reasons I go to L and UL tackle in winter here.

 

-I may go extra heavy to feel bottom substrate.

 

Is this anywhere close to your question?

 

Ah! A river man! Nothing like current to show you that there is a real world out there. :thumbsup: 

No flat ground anywhere near me! Haha. You know what plumbers say about things rolling down hill.........

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4 hours ago, Paul Roberts said:

Is this anywhere close to your question?

Didn't intend my question to be a Rorschack test, just wondered what your preference was... fishing lighter weight jigs or heavier.☺️

 

oe

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25 minutes ago, OkobojiEagle said:

Didn't intend my question to be a Rorschack test, just wondered what your preference was... fishing lighter weight jigs or heavier.☺️

 

oe

I prefer both.

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3 minutes ago, Paul Roberts said:

OK...

 

I use both, for several reasons.

Ditto. My preference is to change with the conditions. I enjoy throwing big heavy Texas rig just as much as a weightless finesse worm 

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I go with the lightest I can get away with in most situations, except for jig fishing. 

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Without fall rate being a factor I fish with the lightest that I can stay in contact with.

 

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When I choose a jig it depends on water depth, wind, and the cover I will be fishing in. 

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On 1/9/2019 at 9:00 AM, OkobojiEagle said:

It's pretty dam* cold outside this morning so I decided to throw out this question.  Do you choose lead jig head weight by the lightest you can feel when being fished or the heaviest you can fish to speed up your presentation?  I've long been in the first camp, first being introduced to the concept by Charlie Brewer's slider techniques.  Most weights I carry run 1/8oz - 3/8oz... most used 1/8, 3/16 & 1/4.  Moving spinnerbaits are 3/8 & 1/2oz because I fish them fast.  I don't often fish deeper than 20 feet. Curious to read where you put yourself.

 

oe

I always start with the lightest weight for soft plastics, then adjust as needed. Jigs the same

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I think I just get more bites using lighter weight, and i don't fish very deep often. I try to stay with 3/16 oz for jigs or T rigs. When i first started using jigs and had no idea how heavy they should be for the situation, I missed a bunch of bites and always ended up going back to T rigs. Going lighter seemed to get the bass to hold the bait better. Now, they usually swim off sideways with it.

 

The C rig is a different story because the bass don't bite the weight.

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