@king fisher is a bass warrior (DDer!), the house comedian, and the Bass Resource philosopher. I really enjoyed your post, bud.

2 hours ago, Rucksack said:

I've never once had this happen to me. I also spend my fishing time in the South and Midwest where it's a super common practice. 

 

However, I'm going to steel man the anti-fishing argument for a second because I think it's worth getting into their headspace. Putting a hook into a fish's mouth and pulling them out of the water absolutely causes some level of suffering. I'm therefore building my pleasure out of some level of fish suffering. Some amount of catch and release fishing results in death. I am sometimes killing fish for my entertainment. I conceded all of those points. 

 

However my license fees and taxes on purchasing supplies directly goes to conservation funding. This results in preservation of natural habitat and pays for state run fish hatcheries. This results in healthier, happier, and more plentiful fish. It also has a positive impact up and down the food web.

 

Putting an economic value on conserved land via a paid hobby is also huge when it comes to political decision making for land conservation. The fishing industry (Johnny Morris was a major player) just stepped up recently to stop the sell of federally protected land. This has generational consequences for humans and our biosphere.

 

I am absolutely bringing more net positive benefits to the environment than I am extracting by fishing. More creatures live healthier and happier lives, because I choose a hobby that causes suffering to some amount of them. It might make some people uncomfortable who aren't systems thinkers, but they should take a broader view.

 

This is basically my response as well. 

 

Most people who bring up moral or ethical criticism of fishing have never considered a systems perspective, and are entirely unprepared for a thoughtful and informed argument along these lines (or along any lines, as they usually don't imagine you've spent you've spent any more time thinking about it than they have)

 

However, I actually almost never hear fishing criticism in person, despite having spent most of my adult life in ivory tower academic settings (including on both coasts), and despite many friends and colleagues who are vegan or vegetarian, or are animal welfare enthusiasts.  Instead, it's usually a rando on social media. 

True story.

Wife and I were camping on a lake and met a nice couple camping beside us.

They came over and sat around the fire and we talked.

Wife and I were discussing our cow that we were going to butcher once we returned from our trip.

To my surprise this older gentleman stood up and said he'd rather not discuss anything to do with cruelty to animals.

 

We changed the subject and all went well.

He invited us over for breakfast and as I was standing beside him as he was frying bacon and sausage,

A small limb fell from above and landed directly into the frying pan, limb was full of caterpillars 😳.

I looked at him with an Eastwood grin as he was cussing and said 

" Frying up live caterpillars in bacon grease is cruelty at the next level "

So my answer as to how to deal with those types of people ❓

With sarcasm 😁

 

 

Interesting topic.

In these situations I'll engage them for a while, looking them straight in the eye while nodding.

After a while I'll get a quizzical look and raise my index finger shaking it ever so slightly.

I'll say, you look really familiar, I know you from somewhere,,,,,,they will then ask a couple of questions and after a pause I'll ask them if they were ever in prison.

That usually ends the conversation pretty quickly   

Those people rarely have any idea how the world really works. They're the kind that get their meat from the grocery store "Where no animals were harmed". They think because they're vegan, no animals were harmed in the process of their food being raised, which is far from the truth. 

 

Like it or not, we're animals, we're part of nature, albeit we have seperated ourselves from it a good bit. Nature is not kind, it is not fair, it is cruel, it is brutal. Animals die of starvation, diesease, are killed immediately upon being born, eaten alive, hit by vegan's cars and left to suffer on the side of the road, and so many other grisly deaths. We should all hope to get to go as quickly as a farm raised animal does. Most farmers take better care of their animals than they do themselves. 

 

I've helped on both my grandparent's farms, hunted and fished for my own food. I have empathy for the animals, that's why they're taken good care of on the farm and killed humanely. That's why we practice shooting. That's why you can't shoot certain animals with certain calibers, because it's not humane. 

 

If nothing else, like @Jig Man said, in most every state, it's illegal to harass someone who is legally fishing or hunting, so call the Game Warden and let them deal with it. Get your phone out and get some video, because they're going to deny it and try to play the victim like you were the problem. 

48 minutes ago, Bluebasser86 said:

If nothing else, like @Jig Man said, in most every state, it's illegal to harass someone who is legally fishing or hunting, so call the Game Warden and let them deal with it. Get your phone out and get some video, because they're going to deny it and try to play the victim like you were the problem. 

 

Agree. Film them harassing you and then call the game warden. I regret not doing this when that woman yelled at me from her screen porch.

 

Here's my dream scenario: The game warden will be too busy and he'll call for backup from the state police. They'll be too busy and they'll call for backup...on and on and on...until the call reaches Clayton. Clayton will arrive and I'll be so happy to see him that I won't care about the Karen and Clayton and I will go fishing. 

I have had a couple of instances of people criticizing me about fishing. I told them I really don’t care about their opinion and they need to mind their own business. 
 

@king fisher said,

"No need to argue with anyone.  I respect their different opinions and If they don't respect mine than we can talk about the weather."

 

I say it's hard to win an argument with a smart man, it's impossible with a stupid one.

 

 

1 hour ago, Lottabass said:

I say it's hard to win an argument with a smart man, it's impossible with a stupid one.

 

So true. I can change my mind because I know I have blindspots. If someone can cast light on my blindspot, I'll shift my position. 

I don't think it would be possible to exist in this world and not be responsible for altering it somehow.

Have the people who thinking fishing is cruel never slapped a mosquito, killed an ant, swatted a fly.

The best we can do when fishing is accept that despite our best efforts every so often a fish will die. At that point some turtle will have a good feast.

16 minutes ago, jbmaine said:

At that point some turtle will have a good feast.

 

The turtle will have to swim faster than an eagle can dive, but I do recall the tale of a turtle that beat a rabbit in a race, so who knows?

It's unlikely that I'd experience this. Living in a rural area, most people either hunt, fish or both. However, When confronted with a challenge by someone with an opposing view, my response goes typically like this....

 

"Before I share my position or reasons, are you willing to listen, really listen,  with an open mind and consider what I'm going to share with you , or will you choose to close your mind and remain ignorant by not honestly reassessing your position and consider other possibilities?"

 

Most folks won't re-evaluate their position or belief. Typically, they dig their heels in deeper trying to justify themselves and create a rebuttal. I don't consider it my obligation or mission in life to convert or convince. I'll gladly share my thoughts with anyone willing to listen as long as their mind is open to other possibilities.

 

 

Look, we spend thousands of dollars to drag a few small fish that wouldn’t sustain our diet out of the water to yell and take pictures and brag about on the internet. This is supported by layers upon layers of technology and commerce. It’s ridiculous from base survival perspective. Don’t argue about it. Be comfortable in what you do and who you are and just move on. People just want attention and content, like this thread.

Some folks are truly tender hearted and others just want attention. All the virtue signaling and yada yada yada gets under my skin . Grow up . 

I'm starting to think that these people that get offended or feel that hooking a fish is cruel,

That they actually took up fishing and some point and couldn't catch a cold. 😁

"That's the point" I say.  "Somebody has to keep these fish in their place.  Have you looked at fish? Vile disgusting things.  AND!.. They're comin' for our LAND!  Have you seen how slimy fish are?  Nothing good comes from something that slimy.  I hear they have schools down there.  What are they teaching?  It's not the word of God, I can assure you that..." 

 

Hopefully by this point they've backed slowly away. 

9 minutes ago, MontanaBasser said:

"That's the point" I say.  "Somebody has to keep these fish in their place.  Have you looked at fish? Vile disgusting things.  AND!.. They're comin' for our LAND!  Have you seen how slimy fish are?  Nothing good comes from something that slimy.  I hear they have schools down there.  What are they teaching?  It's not the word of God, I can assure you that..." 

 

I'm beginning to think this might actually be the best approach...although I suspect it could occasionally backfire drastically.

"I'm sorry you feel that way." 

 

Anything else is likely playing right into what they want to happen.... Getting a reaction/response from you.  

 

IMO we should be self aware enough to recognize that some people view fishing as cruel, especially if we release the fish afterwards (IE, not using the fish for food). Always has been and always will be. Nothing will change their mind and the best thing for all involved is simply polite disengagement.  

I get criticism in the opposite direction. People can't seem to understand why I throw back big bass. They don't understand fishing for, catching and not eating or getting big bass mounted. I'm not against eating bass in any way. I just want to catch the big ones again. Fishing a 30 acre lake, I'm sure it's happened by now. I think I caught the fish in my profile pic twice. I've even had someone ask me for a 5 lb. bass they saw me catch. This ain't the Great Depression. Get your own 5 lb. bass.

I say basically “Thanks for sharing your concerns, I can certainly see where you’re coming from.” Because I can. 
 

They’re not going to convince me, I don’t need to try to convince them. 

It don't bother me. I tell them there's a place for all god's creatures. Right next to the mashed potatoes and gravy...

Ask them if they are Christian. If so, say “And he said unto them, Cast the net on the right side of the ship, and ye shall find. They cast therefore, and now they were not able to draw it for the multitude of fishes.”

 

They casted. I’m casting. Hallelujah!

2 hours ago, IYAOYAS said:

It don't bother me. I tell them there's a place for all god's creatures. Right next to the mashed potatoes and gravy...

Then stare at their toddler and lick your lips aggressively 

it is a sad truth in life that for every single activity, there is a critic. some even vocalize it.

 

take a Wake boat, or Jet ski.  what?  to easy?

 

live and let live I say.  and if they complain, ignore them.  zero Fox giveth.