Posting again about one of the smaller lakes I fish in the midwest (600 acres) and I would like to think I have learned a good bit from the forum over last couple of years, things are starting to make sense but still lots to learn.

My question since we have had the heat and the water temp is climbing I can tell the fish are making adjustments and are moving. Water temps are 85 and higher, thermocline has set up around 12ft or so since its a fairly shallow lake but its pretty obvious. Lake has little to no vegetation, not much rock except for the shoreline but has lots of docks and lots of brushpiles off shore. Most folks are pounding the docks and lifts and just trying to learn more about offshore even in small lakes to maybe carch more fish that are not being harrassed as much.

Sorry such a long winded intro but my question is what is the easiest way to figure out which brushpiles and the likes are holding fish. I have electronics but feel like I am not using then near tonthe degree that I should but with so many brush piles just trying to learn how best to go about it and get better offshore.

Thanks :)

I'd be looking for brush piles that are around the thermocline depth. Docks with fast access to deeper water are also a good option, especially if they have pontoons on them.

Easiest way to learn offshore fish is to look for the birds - herons, grebes, pelicans etc. The birds will be congregated around (or on top of) the baitfish. Bass will be nearby the schools of bait, and in a shallow lake like that I’d wager they will be hunkered up on the bottom.

Your graph should give you a pretty good idea of the depth they’re holding at. In shallow water like that, I’d throw a smallish flutter spoon (like a Dixie Jet) in the middle of the birds to test the waters, then switch to a lightly weighted fluke or a Keitech type swimbait.

If they’re being really difficult, a 4” worm on a light jighead will always put a few in the boat.

1 hour ago, T-Billy said:

I'd be looking for brush piles that are around the thermocline depth. Docks with fast access to deeper water are also a good option, especially if they have pontoons on them.

Yeah I just feelmlike the docks get hammered, they donhold fish and there are a bunch that are in deeper water. Lots of toons, really lots of docks and lifts....

1 hour ago, ElGuapo928 said:

Easiest way to learn offshore fish is to look for the birds - herons, grebes, pelicans etc. The birds will be congregated around (or on top of) the baitfish. Bass will be nearby the schools of bait, and in a shallow lake like that I’d wager they will be hunkered up on the bottom.

Your graph should give you a pretty good idea of the depth they’re holding at. In shallow water like that, I’d throw a smallish flutter spoon (like a Dixie Jet) in the middle of the birds to test the waters, then switch to a lightly weighted fluke or a Keitech type swimbait.

If they’re being really difficult, a 4” worm on a light jighead will always put a few in the boat.

Lots of herons, usually around the docks, lake has lots of baitfish, lots....gizzard shad, crappie, bluegill and lors of green sunfish. Last week everything seemed suspended above the thermocline, it wqs hot all week with bluebird skies. I just need to get better with my electronics. There is so much brush offshore, just not sure where to start, lol...

3 hours ago, bishoptf said:

what is the easiest way

I quoted what might be holding you back.

There is no easy way, so stop looking for it.

Understanding that this is a grind and believing that you can do it will carry you through.

Social media, including me, posts all these happy reports and pics of fish.

But what you do not see are the hours, days, months, and even seasons of fishless recon

where information was gained but few fish were caught.

If you need to fish every brush pile once in the morning and again in the late afternoon, then

you need to fish every brush pile once in the morning and again in the late afternoon.

Bassheds who make it happen - didn't have an easy button.

They fished the heck out of places and learned the bass & the bait.

Do it; it's fun.

It's called bass fishing.

Good Luck.

A-Jay

7 minutes ago, A-Jay said:

I quoted what might be holding you back.

There is no easy way, so stop looking for it.

Understanding that this is a grind and believing that you can do it will carry you through.

Social media, including me, posts all these happy reports and pics of fish.

But what you do not see are the hours, days, months, and even seasons of fishless recon

where information was gained but few fish were caught.

If you need to fish every brush pile once in the morning and again in the late afternoon, then

you need to fish every brush pile once in the morning and again in the late afternoon.

Bassheds who make it happen - didn't have an easy button.

They fished the heck out of places and learned the bass & the bait.

Do it; it's fun.

It's called bass fishing.

Good Luck.

A-Jay

Eh there are some that are better than others....I agree with the time on the water but I also know that I am not using my electronics near to what there capability. Probably should not have used easiest but pretty sure there are some ways better than other when breaking things down. Not possible to fish every brush pile in this lake on a given day there are just to many, just like its not possible to fish all of the docks, just to many. I understand what your saying and don't disagree with the time on the water, year two for me averaging 2-3 days a week year round. I still haven't figured out winter patterns at all but this year with it being year two I do see things a bit more clearly but just like when it gets cold and fish move offshore they do similar things when it gets hot and just looking for ways or suggestions to go about finding them. I do not have FFS and not planning on getting it but as we can all agree it does wonders for helping you find offshore fish.

3 hours ago, bishoptf said:

Yeah I just feelmlike the docks get hammered, they donhold fish and there are a bunch that are in deeper water. Lots of toons, really lots of docks and lifts....

Lots of herons, usually around the docks, lake has lots of baitfish, lots....gizzard shad, crappie, bluegill and lors of green sunfish. Last week everything seemed suspended above the thermocline, it wqs hot all week with bluebird skies. I just need to get better with my electronics. There is so much brush offshore, just not sure where to start, lol...

Don’t worry about electronics too much - I usually turn my graphs off when I’m chasing schools, just to lose the distraction.

Herons are your best friend when locating fish - they will start squawking and raising hell when you get close, then they will move to another spot, but not far from bait. Use the space between where you first saw the bird and where he moved to as your area to start picking apart.

Gizzard Shad present another piece of the puzzle to exploit: Put a “shad” pattern/colored Fluke on a 1/16 or 1/8 oz keel weighted hook and let it fall to the bottom. Rip it off the bottom, let it fall again and watch for your line to move. Most of the time it’s going to be a really quick pressure bite, if you’re not paying really close attention, he’s already spit it out and moved on.

Bluebird skies coupled with hot days generally means sloooooooow fishing. Don’t be shy about downsizing and basically dead sticking it. Patience is key, don’t get discouraged. Sometimes in Summer if you get 5-6 BITES a day, you’re fishing hard.

Just to add another idea, go hit those spots that have been getting hammered with a weightless Senko, a dropshot or tiny swimbait - I’ve caught a ton of fish following the minnow diddlers (FFS guys) with a reaper on a dropshot.

@bishoptf I'd go with your gut to start in this situation, and simplify approach. If you're unsure, even with your minimal electronics, fish the brush you have a hunch on. Look for discrepancies with them. Some should stand out from others, and then you can hone in on the productive ones. If you get that "I just have a feeling about this spot", hit it. You may be wrong, but often strong intuitive pulls are for a reason. Good luck bro, you'll figure it out man.

29 minutes ago, JonB2 said:

You may be wrong, but often strong intuitive pulls are for a reason.

I was reading this thread and thinking, "Lots of good advice here."

And I was also thinking, i'm not going to post because my advice would sound silly: "Go with your hunches."

Because that's what I do. Don't assume that my hunches come from the ether. They come from the pond. I frequently stop fishing and just look. I look to the left. I look to the right. I'm always watching. In shallow water, I can see bass twitch brush overhanging the water. In deep water, I don't know if I can see anything similarly informative, but maybe I can. When bass move their bodies, they move water too.

I have an internal voice that sometimes says, "Oh, there's a bass there."

And I'll cast to the middle of the pond and sure enough, there's a bass there. Did I see something I can't even name? I don't know.

And now I'm thinking that all of the above is worthless, but decades of watching the water might give us insights.

Fish em all.

This is how I would approach this lake the first time knowing only what you have told me.

First let's eliminate unproductive water. It's only 600 acres to begin with. It's hot so we can probably eliminate the shallow water. There's a thermocline at 12 feet so we can eliminate water over 12 feet deep. That shouldn't leave much water. I would focus on areas with the right depth near the best structure. Honestly, I would probably fish the deeper docks and try to show them something they haven't seen. Fish don't stop using docks because of fishing pressure, they're just harder to catch. Also there are probably lots of brush piles around the docks.

There's a lot of information I don't know that might change my approach. What is the water clarity? What is likely the primary forage for the bass? Does the lake have a lot of structure?

Expanding on "the grind," as @A-Jay describes it, you go to a lake and you find likely places where bass may hang out using your electronics and your eyes. These places may be drop-offs, channel swings, underwater ditches, grass and weeds, docks, brush piles, combinations of these, etc. Not every place is going to hold bass. In fact, many will not. Your task is to cycle through these based on your knowledge of conditions and bass behavior to find which areas the bass are using today at this particular time. This, then, is the grind. After visiting a lake numerous times you develop a sense of which places are used at different times of the year and what lures and techniques to use. But once you reach this point the worst of "the grind" is over. You know the lake and you can quickly determine where bass are going to be located on a lot of days. And once you reach this point with a particular lake, that is when the intuition that @Swamp Girl talked about comes into play. You look at, or think of a spot where you think bass will be and, like Babe Ruth, you call your shot. Those are the good days. Of course, there are days when even what you have learned about that lake simply won't put too many bass in the boat. Bass are independent creatures and we can't always know their motivations. That's fishing.

Down here in my neck of the wood's temperatures reach up to 110 degrees with the heat index during the day. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Do some Night Fishing. Midnight is a good time here.

Good Fishing

It’s Hot Out—Go Night Fishing for Bass Instead | The Ultimate Bass Fishing Resource Guide® LLC

@Swamp Girl I don't worry about being silly, hunches are real and a good thing. Not everyone is as in tune internally as others, but if you are; trust your gut feelings. They're primal, raw and often wise. I do the same as you, and have whacked a good fish or had a little flurry doing just as you described. Trust it, go with it.

I’m a big proponent of following hunches - has usually had positive results for me. Plus the occasions where you call your shot (“there’s a fish there” right before the cast) are a huge shot in the arm.

I think @Tennessee Boy and I think the same way. Bass fishing, work, board games, etc are all just a puzzle/problem to solve. So for me, any problem that needs to be solved needs a methodology or process of elimination. If you can definitively say that something isn’t true, then you can eliminate that possibility.

In this case, prove that there is a thermocline- crank up the sensitivity on 2D and see that it is there. If so, then go onto your maps and do depth highlights. Highlight anything deeper than the thermocline in red and don’t bother with it. In the first 10 minutes on the water, you’ve eliminated a huge chunk of water. Now fix the sensitivity back to normal and just mosey around to see where there is ‘life’ in the water. It could be baitfish schools, it could be fish generally, or could be birds around. Note the depths and types of things they are around. You might find that they are roaming open water with bait. They might be hanging in 10-12’ right above the thermocline. They might be up shallow (I never ignore <2’ deep water even if it is 85+ degrees). If you want to learn the brushpiles deeper, then ride around and mark them on your mapping. Mark every one you see. Look for fish and if you see them great, but for now you just want to map them all. For now, just focus on the ones shallower than the thermocline (deeper ones could be more important other times of the year). Once you have them mapped, you now know what the playing field is.

Down imaging and 2D side by side are what I find most useful for identifying fish. 2D is pretty obvious when you go over them. Down imaging will let you see where they are relative to the cover, how big, how many, etc. Start graphing over the ones you’ve marked and see what you find. Check the deeper ones and the shallow ones. If you can’t see fish, then just start fishing them. Drag a jig, run a crankbait through them, Carolina rig. Cover water until you find one or two. Then you can slow down with a drop shot or something else. Once you figure out something, now you have a map of brushpiles to go explore all mapped out. Use your depth highlights to show you which ones to focus more time on. If you catch a couple at 10’, then highlight 8-12’ and go have a closer look at those piles again on 2D/DI.

Other things to note for the ones that have fish- are they around dropoffs, does the creek channel swing near them, is there a harder or softer bottom there? Flats vs steep? You said not much veg or rock, so if you find any in the right depth zone, fish that. And if there isn’t much rock then I’d guess it’s a softer bottom so anything with a harder/clean bottom (outside creek channel swings) is a good option.

Now all that might help you filter down which ones to fish first, but you still have to fish them and put the time on the water.

1 hour ago, casts_by_fly said:

I think @Tennessee Boy and I think the same way. Bass fishing, work, board games, etc are all just a puzzle/problem to solve. So for me, any problem that needs to be solved needs a methodology or process of elimination. If you can definitively say that something isn’t true, then you can eliminate that possibility.

In this case, prove that there is a thermocline- crank up the sensitivity on 2D and see that it is there. If so, then go onto your maps and do depth highlights. Highlight anything deeper than the thermocline in red and don’t bother with it. In the first 10 minutes on the water, you’ve eliminated a huge chunk of water. Now fix the sensitivity back to normal and just mosey around to see where there is ‘life’ in the water. It could be baitfish schools, it could be fish generally, or could be birds around. Note the depths and types of things they are around. You might find that they are roaming open water with bait. They might be hanging in 10-12’ right above the thermocline. They might be up shallow (I never ignore <2’ deep water even if it is 85+ degrees). If you want to learn the brushpiles deeper, then ride around and mark them on your mapping. Mark every one you see. Look for fish and if you see them great, but for now you just want to map them all. For now, just focus on the ones shallower than the thermocline (deeper ones could be more important other times of the year). Once you have them mapped, you now know what the playing field is.

Down imaging and 2D side by side are what I find most useful for identifying fish. 2D is pretty obvious when you go over them. Down imaging will let you see where they are relative to the cover, how big, how many, etc. Start graphing over the ones you’ve marked and see what you find. Check the deeper ones and the shallow ones. If you can’t see fish, then just start fishing them. Drag a jig, run a crankbait through them, Carolina rig. Cover water until you find one or two. Then you can slow down with a drop shot or something else. Once you figure out something, now you have a map of brushpiles to go explore all mapped out. Use your depth highlights to show you which ones to focus more time on. If you catch a couple at 10’, then highlight 8-12’ and go have a closer look at those piles again on 2D/DI.

Other things to note for the ones that have fish- are they around dropoffs, does the creek channel swing near them, is there a harder or softer bottom there? Flats vs steep? You said not much veg or rock, so if you find any in the right depth zone, fish that. And if there isn’t much rock then I’d guess it’s a softer bottom so anything with a harder/clean bottom (outside creek channel swings) is a good option.

Now all that might help you filter down which ones to fish first, but you still have to fish them and put the time on the water.

No channel swings, no real points...think lowland reservoir, man made, not real deep. I actually have things charted and have fished it enough to know where almost everything is located. I aslo have the water deeper than 12ft already shaded. Almost everyone beats the banks since there are lots of docks and boat lifts, just would like to figure something offshore that may be more productive

Most everything has been covered already but it's possible you're overthinking it also. The lake near my house isn't real deep but has some good offshore structure like rocky drop offs, a roadbed, a couple sunken docks, several brushpiles, but it's also completely rimmed with residential docks. The last couple times out, I've been stubborn and stuck to trying to fish the offshore fish, with pretty minimal success minus chasing roamers on scope, those fish are chasing YOY shad and have their feedbags on, but they're also almost all smaller than 15". Each trip, I eventually get frustrated and give up on the offshore fish and start skipping docks with an urchin and fishing the slop with a frog, and the bites start coming and they've been bigger fish every time. I see the other boats, and every person I pass is fishing a wacky rig under the docks, or a finesse bait under them. I haven't seen anyone fishing the frog and only a couple urchins and they're just fishing the edges, not skipping under the docks.

The fish were right where everyone else is fishing, I just had to do something different to make them bite.

I never found a brushpile I didnt like. If it doesnt produce one trip it may very well produce multiples next trip. I dont pass any of them up. Off shore brushpiles are my favorite place to throw big worms.

16 minutes ago, Bluebasser86 said:

Most everything has been covered already but it's possible you're overthinking it also. The lake near my house isn't real deep but has some good offshore structure like rocky drop offs, a roadbed, a couple sunken docks, several brushpiles, but it's also completely rimmed with residential docks. The last couple times out, I've been stubborn and stuck to trying to fish the offshore fish, with pretty minimal success minus chasing roamers on scope, those fish are chasing YOY shad and have their feedbags on, but they're also almost all smaller than 15". Each trip, I eventually get frustrated and give up on the offshore fish and start skipping docks with an urchin and fishing the slop with a frog, and the bites start coming and they've been bigger fish every time. I see the other boats, and every person I pass is fishing a wacky rig under the docks, or a finesse bait under them. I haven't seen anyone fishing the frog and only a couple urchins and they're just fishing the edges, not skipping under the docks.

The fish were right where everyone else is fishing, I just had to do something different to make them bite.

Yup Indont disagree, not angood skipper and need tonget better at doing that but from the local weekly derby everyone that I know is hitting the docks but your correct about getting the bait further back etc and using something different. There is a lot of brush in the lake and if I was better with my electronics inprobably could eliminate some quicker but still a wirknin progress. About to go out and decided to spit my four hours up into half and half, half hitting some brushpiles and half hitting the docks...

13 minutes ago, scaleface said:

I never found a brushpile I didnt like. If it doesnt produce one trip it may very well produce multiples next trip. I dont pass any of them up. Off shore brushpiles are my favorite place to throw big worms.

There is just to many tonfish at one time, i need to get better at understanding which ones would be better than others...I will try to take a screenshot of my map when I get back today. Here is the lake and every one of the marking isnbrush and there is more that I do not have listed....

18 minutes ago, bishoptf said:

There is just to many to fish at one time, i need to get better at understanding which ones would be better than others...

When "learning a lake," there's no time limit.

So using the 'one day' deal as part of the process would be limiting my success.

Success doesn't mean catching fish at this point.

I cannot do either one of these effectively when I try to do both at the same time.

I'm either learning or fishing—sometimes it happens accidentally at the same time,

but it's rarely the initial plan.

It's more about eliminating water seasonally.

Once I have a decent idea of where to go,

(which always takes me more than one day unless I am fishing a puddle)

I will set up a 'milk run' of spots.

Hit them and move, hit & move.

A concept that is as old as bass fishing.

Good Luck

A-Jay

Looking at your map, I see a lot of appealing areas. I wouldn’t overthink it so much, every point, dock, swing, brush pile, rock, Buick LeSabre, whatever is in the water can be habitat at any given point - but the fish can also be completely pelagic.

I’d honestly stick more toward the banks from what I see - throw a reaction bait, a finesse bait and somewhere in the middle. If you’re not getting bit, bounce to another appealing looking spot and repeat.

Don’t get too bound up in thermoclines either - I’ve caught fish in 3 feet of water on Havasu when it was 120 degrees, then turned around and picked up more at 50 feet when the thermocline was showing at 25 feet.

4 hours ago, bishoptf said:

Yup Indont disagree, not angood skipper and need tonget better at doing that but from the local weekly derby everyone that I know is hitting the docks but your correct about getting the bait further back etc and using something different. There is a lot of brush in the lake and if I was better with my electronics inprobably could eliminate some quicker but still a wirknin progress. About to go out and decided to spit my four hours up into half and half, half hitting some brushpiles and half hitting the docks...

There is just to many tonfish at one time, i need to get better at understanding which ones would be better than others...I will try to take a screenshot of my map when I get back today. Here is the lake and every one of the marking isnbrush and there is more that I do not have listed....

Always tough to tell from a snippet like this, but you definitely have multiple points and flats to target. If that's the lake I think it is, looking at it on navionics now I can see why most people are fishing the bank- most all the main lake is lined with docks where the end of the dock is over about 12-15'. If you have a hard thermocline at 12' then that limits how far they are going to come off the bank. A whole bunch of that lake is deeper than 12' just a cast length from the bank.

If you are going to try to put together something that isn't docks, I think you're going to struggle since almost the entire lake is ringed with them. There isn't a whole lot of area left that isn't docks. The off the bank areas are pretty flat, though there are points (some rounded, some a little steeper) that are worth fishing. Where the two creek arms meet in your upper right corner, the piece of bank in between them has deeper water pushing up pretty close to shore. With two sets of fresh water coming into the lake there and deep water nearby (plus the piles you've marked), I'd be looking at that. Certainly that's a prespawn staging area.